[Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

Shara
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[Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by Shara » Mon Mar 20, 2017 22:00

Mountain climbing mod which adds a climbing pick tool. Use the tool to add handholds to stone, desert stone, sandstone and ice which can then be climbed.

Screenshots:
The handholds nodes:
Image

Climbing a mountain:
Image


Download: https://github.com/Ezhh/handholds/archive/master.zip

Dependencies: default

Source: https://github.com/Ezhh/handholds

License: Code is MIT. Textures are CC BY-SA 4.0.
 

sofar
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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by sofar » Mon Mar 20, 2017 22:51

:+1: I really like this idea! I usually don't fanclub posts like this, but as a former rock climber, this is great!
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by duane » Mon Mar 20, 2017 23:56

Nice. It's a different method than Don Batman uses. Probably more efficient.
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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by Shara » Tue Mar 21, 2017 16:17

sofar - thank you. Really appreciate the feedback, fanclubbing or otherwise! :)

duane - I have always admired Don's mods, so I take that as a huge compliment. Thanks for taking the time to have a look and comment.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by ErrorNull » Tue Mar 21, 2017 23:55

very nice! does the speed at which you climb the same as ladder? i haven't tried mod yet, but i think slower would be more realistic or players will never care to make ladders again....
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by Shara » Wed Mar 22, 2017 01:17

azekill_DIABLO - Thank you

ErrorNull - I don't want to make it slower than ladders. Keep in mind there are only four nodes this works on; for anything else you still need a ladder. Also when climbing cliffs, there are usually softer nodes at the top (dirt above stone, or snow above ice) into which you can't make handholds, so you'd either need to dig steps or use a ladder there as well.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by stu » Wed Mar 22, 2017 17:53

+1 This should go straight into MTG. Very nice mod!
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by sofar » Wed Mar 22, 2017 18:22

stu wrote:+1 This should go straight into MTG. Very nice mod!


Interesting thought. For a second I was "noooo". But then I think we can make a compromise: What if this tool would only work on sandstone and desert sandstone?

I mean, it would be way too easy if this would work in stone. You wouldn't need ladders going down and mining would not cost any material. So first i thought of only making this work in the overworld. But a much simpler way to restrict this to "near surface" and "occasional rare areas underground" would be to allow this on sandstones only.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by paramat » Wed Mar 22, 2017 18:52

> but i think slower would be more realistic or players will never care to make ladders again....

Climb speed in MT is universal for all nodes. I am proposing raising the universal climb speed further to 3.5.

If included i feel it should be all 4 nodes, anything less than the basic 4 natural mapgen nodes makes it fairly pointless.
I can understand devs feeling this makes climbing too easy, i am concerned about that too.
Last edited by paramat on Wed Mar 22, 2017 20:10, edited 5 times in total.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by Shara » Wed Mar 22, 2017 19:00

I'd be honoured for it to be included and would be very happy to work with the devs on any adjustments needed.

I will note that I feel very strongly about game balance. I'd suggest considering making the tool more difficult to make (perhaps reverting to the original requirement of diamonds?) so that in the early stages, before you have done some decent mining, ladders remain the only option. Tool durability can also be adjusted so it doesn't last as long and the cost will deter constant use. I'm open for any other suggestions to balance it as well.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by stu » Wed Mar 22, 2017 20:08

As a suggestion, on the point of balance, how about making them 'erode' over time? Essentially just make them disappear very slowly by ABM or node timers. Times could vary between different surfaces. Just an idea.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by Shara » Wed Mar 22, 2017 20:18

stu - I did start thinking along those lines and it would make a lot of sense to me, perhaps especially below a certain depth. I'm just not sure if there is a nice way to implement it. I generally try to avoid using a lot of ABMs since I've seen too many of them bring a server to its knees a fair few times, yet it would certainly add an interesting twist to this.

There's also the issue that it's nice if they can be used in some more permanent structures. So maybe proximity to water (or something else could be better?) could be the trigger for them to wear away, much like cobble to mossy cobble? Maybe let's see if the devs have any thoughts on that point. I'm certainly open to suggestions.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by stu » Wed Mar 22, 2017 20:40

I understand your concerns over ABMs but I am pretty sure there are more efficient way to do things like this now, I know too little about node timers to say if they perform any better, However, erosion would be intentionally slow so should not present too much of a problem, imo.

I also like the other possibilities for permanent structures, they could even be used as decoration :)
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by Shara » Wed Mar 22, 2017 21:19

I've not tried anything with node timers before, but if that would address the devs' concern I'll look into it. I think switching to diamonds/ adjusting number of uses is probably going to be preferable, but will see if they have more to say on it first.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by FaceDeer » Thu Mar 23, 2017 07:46

Oh, this is very nice! It solves the main problem I had with Don's mason hammer handholds, the recessed "groove" that it puts in the rock face. I like this.

For balance I think fiddling with the tool wear rate is probably the best approach. Having the handholds "erode" over time feels very arbitrary and gamey to me, especially if there's a depth dependency - there's no realistic reason why such a thing would happen.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by azekill_DIABLO » Thu Mar 23, 2017 17:16

red-001 wrote:Maybe you could use a node timer instead of an ABM?


I was about to say it. gn.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by Shara » Thu Mar 23, 2017 19:00

FaceDeer - Thank you.

I've now switched the recipe back to requiring diamonds and tweaked the durability as well. I think this should help with balance issues, but happy to hear feedback or further suggestions.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by D00Med » Thu Mar 23, 2017 20:24

This is a really nice idea!
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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by paramat » Fri Mar 24, 2017 22:59

Durability gets you 256 uses per pick, enough for a tall mountain, seems good to me and balanced.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by Shara » Sun Mar 26, 2017 02:08

Thanks D00Med and paramat.

Minor update made to improve checks as well, so please update if you are using this.
 

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Re: [Mod] Mountain Climbing [handholds]

by Sokomine » Fri Apr 07, 2017 04:32

Looks very nice. Don't make it too expensive! It looks way better than pillars of dirt or cobble created by players who want to reach the top of a mountain. It's even pretty decorative. As for mines: Ladders are too slow for them anyway.
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