[WIP] Undergrowth [GitHub]

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Neuromancer
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by Neuromancer » Post

There's something odd about this Modpack and other Modpacks. Even when it appears I have all dependencies satisified, this Modpack won't work. If I enable it and save it, and come back in, I see that it isn't saved, or if I just go hit play and go into the world the modpack isn't enabled. But if I throw this modpack into my game, then it works just fine. My guess is that there is a hidden dependency that is met by my game, but I'm not sure what it is.

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by Evergreen » Post

Neuromancer wrote:There's something odd about this Modpack and other Modpacks. Even when it appears I have all dependencies satisified, this Modpack won't work. If I enable it and save it, and come back in, I see that it isn't saved, or if I just go hit play and go into the world the modpack isn't enabled. But if I throw this modpack into my game, then it works just fine. My guess is that there is a hidden dependency that is met by my game, but I'm not sure what it is.
I think it is a glitch, it seems that modpacks disable themselves every time I quit the game. It is very strange.
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by Mossmanikin » Post

Evergreen wrote:Idea: Once I finish the cavestuff, I'll start working on "beach". ;)
Sounds like a good idea.
Neuromancer wrote:I was watching a documentary on spirituality, and thought it might be a cool idea to create a spirituality mod, but then I realized that this mod, and the other mods that bring natural beauty bring a spirituality to Minetest. I find myself wandering the landscape just reveling in the beauty of it all.
^! Spirituality is all about experiencing nature, at least for me.
Neuromancer wrote:What do you guys use to create your nodeboxes? Do you use blender, or something else?
I just use a text editor and minetest. I love when lines of code become "alive".
Neuromancer wrote:@MM: I like what you are doing with the twigs, laying them on top of the ground as a flat texture. I think this would be a great idea for adding moss, fungus and decay to rotting logs. But there is something wrong with the twigs, they are too regular. I think you need at least 1 more variation slightly off the 45 degree angle that the current twig is at, and at a different length. Otherwise the pattern is too predictable and looks fake.
Yeah, I thought about adding moss in a similar way. I wasn't sure if it would be too complex if I added another twig shape. It's the compromise between pixel game and nature... Will try to make another texture.
Neuromancer wrote:Also: thanks for fixing the allsides optional in the bushes mod!
You're welcome, wasn't sure if I had the "right" to do so. :)
VanessaE wrote:Idea: match on apples and on moretrees _ongen apple tree saplings (both at mapgen time). Generate a few "overripe" ones on the ground around/under those trees. Not sure what to DO with them if the player picks one up, maybe they can be cooked or something to make them edible.

Might be a good idea to use the signlike draw type so that the apple appers to be flat on the ground, or do like you're doing with the fallen leaves.
Like that idea. Maybe we could introduce compost as an alternative to bone meal.
Neuromancer wrote:The more I think of it the more I like moss. It can grow on the side of fallen logs, trees, natural stone, stone monuments, ruins, etc.
Yeah, moss and fungi should be there. Still didn't have the time to take a close look at all the, old and new, mods featuring these, but we should make sure the forest is alive.
Neuromancer wrote:I often feel guilty about how I always point out the flaws in MM's creations, or how I come up with an endless supply of ideas for him to implement while I barely have the time to implement anything myself. Then I play the game with all of his mods and I think to myself I'm so glad I have done this! It was worth it! He has achieved something absolutely incredible! I used to look at Minetest as something fun and addictive but fairly clunky looking, but MM has turned it into something that goes beyond anything I have imagined possible. MM, we all owe you a huge debt of gratitude.
I'm glad you have all these ideas. Often similar ideas already crossed my mind, but it's a different thing when someone else, who knows the game and is willing to look at the real life examples, has those ideas. No matter if I have the time to code the stuff, those ideas won't die, and yes they help a lot. Even if you wouldn't code a single line, it would still be our(!) work.
Nobody owes me anything. If I don't release my stuff in vain, even if there's only one person on this planet whom can use it for whatever, I got my salary. ;)
VanessaE wrote:This modpack is now supported by HDX :)

(or at least, it supports what was present as of a few hours ago. :D )
Absolutely great!
Neuromancer wrote:I know we're supposed to fork, and I will if you want me to, but I added a moss texture and node to the trunks mod because it seems to make sense that moss would most likely grow on the side of fallen logs. Feel free to rip it out if you want. It probably needs variations on the texture to make it look more realistic. I decided to go with signlike just to see how that looked and worked. Whats cool as you can stick it on top of or on the side of just about anything.
We're supposed to...
We all need rules, but exceptions make the rule. ;)
I'll take a closer look after I got some sleep.

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by twoelk » Post

I think compost is a great idea, I never liked the bones approach. Something that sticks, twigs and leaves could be used for. (Leaves could really need more uses) Maybe you could add a rainworm to start the process, similar to the queen bee from the "Bees and Beekeeper" mod. Rainworms could could be obtained randomly when tiling with a hoe, or digging dirt.
Last edited by twoelk on Sun Sep 29, 2013 14:11, edited 1 time in total.

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by Mossmanikin » Post

Neuromancer wrote:I added a moss texture and node to the trunks mod because it seems to make sense that moss would most likely grow on the side of fallen logs. Feel free to rip it out if you want. It probably needs variations on the texture to make it look more realistic. I decided to go with signlike just to see how that looked and worked. Whats cool as you can stick it on top of or on the side of just about anything.
Looks great, fits very well to logs and soil.
Will certainly not rip it out, instead write a few lines for spawning. :)
Maybe mossy rocks would also look nice.

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by Evergreen » Post

Mossmanikin wrote:
Neuromancer wrote:I added a moss texture and node to the trunks mod because it seems to make sense that moss would most likely grow on the side of fallen logs. Feel free to rip it out if you want. It probably needs variations on the texture to make it look more realistic. I decided to go with signlike just to see how that looked and worked. Whats cool as you can stick it on top of or on the side of just about anything.
Looks great, fits very well to logs and soil.
Will certainly not rip it out, instead write a few lines for spawning. :)
Maybe mossy rocks would also look nice.
I could do that. Sorry for not working on it, I am just lazy. :P
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by Mossmanikin » Post

Evergreen wrote:I could do that.
Cool, I think it would add a lot of athmosphere.
Evergreen wrote:Sorry for not working on it, I am just lazy. :P
The right to be lazy is a fundamental right. ;D

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by Neuromancer » Post

Mossmanikin wrote:
Neuromancer wrote:I added a moss texture and node to the trunks mod because it seems to make sense that moss would most likely grow on the side of fallen logs. Feel free to rip it out if you want. It probably needs variations on the texture to make it look more realistic. I decided to go with signlike just to see how that looked and worked. Whats cool as you can stick it on top of or on the side of just about anything.
Looks great, fits very well to logs and soil.
Will certainly not rip it out, instead write a few lines for spawning. :)
Maybe mossy rocks would also look nice.
I think mossy rocks would look great! I was considering trying some other textures for rocks rather than just the standard gray, but I wasn't sure what. I think the moss textures need more variety or need to be tweaked. Oddly enough on logs moss seems to go in straight bands down the length of the log. In my walks in the woods I noticed that the moss (especially) and fungus seem to go more towards the top of the log rather than the bottom.
Last edited by Neuromancer on Mon Sep 30, 2013 00:33, edited 1 time in total.

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by Evergreen » Post

Neuromancer wrote:
Mossmanikin wrote:
Neuromancer wrote:I added a moss texture and node to the trunks mod because it seems to make sense that moss would most likely grow on the side of fallen logs. Feel free to rip it out if you want. It probably needs variations on the texture to make it look more realistic. I decided to go with signlike just to see how that looked and worked. Whats cool as you can stick it on top of or on the side of just about anything.
Looks great, fits very well to logs and soil.
Will certainly not rip it out, instead write a few lines for spawning. :)
Maybe mossy rocks would also look nice.
I think mossy rocks would look great! I was considering trying some other textures for rocks rather than just the standard gray, but I wasn't sure what. I think the moss textures need more variety or need to be tweaked. Oddly enough on logs moss seems to go in straight bands down the length of the log. In my walks in the woods I noticed that the moss (especially) and fungus seem to go more towards the top of the log rather than the bottom.
If you could make some textures, that would be great.
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by Neuromancer » Post

I have an idea for the twig textures. The existing one looks great, but I would add additional textures that maybe have multiple twigs on one node and/or have twigs that when the nodes are oriented the right way combine to make one long twig, otherwise make 2 short twigs when not oriented toward each other.

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by Neuromancer » Post

I changed the nodebox for the bush branches to instead of being 2 nodeboxes standing next to each other in the middle, to be 3 nodeboxes stacked on top of each other, each one above the last branching out further. The old look was much more predictable. The new one looks radically different based on the angle you take, but may look more natural. Guys, please let me know your opinion, have I improved the look of the bush branches or have I made them worse?

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by VanessaE » Post

That's looking better, Neuro, but the bottom portion of the "branching out" side is being cut off:

Image

Also, don't forget to make textures/nodeboxes to handle the adjacent viewing angles (e.g. from the left/right in the image).

For the twig textures, I'd recommend making say 6 different sticks textures and just let facedir handle the rest. No need to try to make joinable ones, as they'll look cut off when not joined.

Side note: Could you change the filename of the texture being used for the "leaves" in these bushes, so I can texture them separately in HDX?

Side note: When the player digs dirt/grass with leaves, it should split the leaves off first and give those to the player (perhaps dead leaves), and then the dirt node next. Perhaps have some code that allows the leaves to be re-joined with on-ground dirt/grass nodes. See the behavior of homedecor's signs-on-posts to see what I mean.
You might like some of my stuff: Plantlife ~ More Trees ~ Home Decor ~ Pipeworks ~ HDX Textures (64-512px)

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by Mossmanikin » Post

Neuromancer wrote:I have an idea for the twig textures. The existing one looks great, but I would add additional textures that maybe have multiple twigs on one node and/or have twigs that when the nodes are oriented the right way combine to make one long twig, otherwise make 2 short twigs when not oriented toward each other.
I'll make some more twig textures with different sizes and shapes.
VanessaE wrote:For the twig textures, I'd recommend making say 6 different sticks textures and just let facedir handle the rest. No need to try to make joinable ones, as they'll look cut off when not joined.
Yeah, makes sense. Six might be too much, but I'll play with different ones.
Neuromancer wrote:I changed the nodebox for the bush branches to instead of being 2 nodeboxes standing next to each other in the middle, to be 3 nodeboxes stacked on top of each other, each one above the last branching out further. The old look was much more predictable. The new one looks radically different based on the angle you take, but may look more natural. Guys, please let me know your opinion, have I improved the look of the bush branches or have I made them worse?
IMO the bushes look better now. But it looks as if there's something missing. The branches selected on Vanessa's screenshot look a bit like they're floating.
VanessaE wrote:Side note: When the player digs dirt/grass with leaves, it should split the leaves off first and give those to the player (perhaps dead leaves), and then the dirt node next. Perhaps have some code that allows the leaves to be re-joined with on-ground dirt/grass nodes. See the behavior of homedecor's signs-on-posts to see what I mean.
Interesting idea. On one hand I like it, it would support the idea of compost. On the other hand I'm not sure if it would be a good thing to let it become default dirt and then grass. I'll have to think about it. Other opinions and ideas to what the nodes should change are very welcome.

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by jojoa1997 » Post

Maybe you might want to change the (no download yet) to (github)
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by Mossmanikin » Post

jojoa1997 wrote:Maybe you might want to change the (no download yet) to (github)
Good idea.

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by Neuromancer » Post

@VanessaE: Thanks for the suggestions. The nodeboxes were oriented the wrong way, branching inward instead of outward. This has been fixed so the bottom is no longer cut off. Also the side image used to be a blank image. This has also been fixed. I'll work on the leaf names. Also I wonder if I should name this mod something else, since as you pointed out there already was a "classic" bushes mod. What was this mod called? Bushes, right? What did you call it when it got moved into your modpack? Won't there be conflicts if someone wants to use both of these bush mods at the same time with no modpacks?

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by VanessaE » Post

Originally it was called 'bushes' but I've since renamed it in Plantlife to bushes_classic. It still uses the original node names, but there's no conflict with your mod. Keep yours the way it is, it is a better use of the word anyway (as bushes_classic never got expanded beyond providing wild strawberries and some related items).

Meanwhile, I suggest using a flat nodebox for the moss. The signlike drawtype makes it "float" above the object it sits on, which looks kinda odd on the trees.

The rest is looking very good.
You might like some of my stuff: Plantlife ~ More Trees ~ Home Decor ~ Pipeworks ~ HDX Textures (64-512px)

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by Neuromancer » Post

I'm not sure sticks float on water. I'm pretty sure they sink, and the big ones "stick" out of the water. However Leaves do float on water. So do these little green circles.

Image
Image
Last edited by Neuromancer on Fri Oct 04, 2013 14:52, edited 1 time in total.

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by jojoa1997 » Post

The circles are lily pads
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by BrandonReese » Post

Neuromancer wrote:I'm not sure sticks float on water.
Most wood floats.

Image

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by Neuromancer » Post

Something about the twigs bothered me. The fact that they were all perfectly centered in the node just looked fake to me. So I slid them over to the edge of the node. I was hoping to get the effect of multiple twigs joined together to make one large twig. Instead what I got was what looked like a long twig that got stepped on an broken, but still a cool effect. And not so centered on the node they look more natural. But I also got 2 random pixels on the sides of the nodes. At first I thought this looked bad like a glitch, but when approaching the twigs from far away, it looks like all kinds of random natural twig debris on the ground. Try it out. Change the texture names to use the 3 "e" textures e.g. trunks_twig_1e. I'm not saying this is perfect, some glitches need to be ironed out, but I really like the look of it! Try it out, start wandering around seeing all the random debris on the ground and let me know what you think.
Last edited by Neuromancer on Fri Oct 04, 2013 15:40, edited 1 time in total.

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by Neuromancer » Post

jojoa1997 wrote:The circles are lily pads
No I meant the tiny dots of green. Algea?

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by Casimir » Post

It's delicious duckweed.

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by Neuromancer » Post

BrandonReese wrote:
Neuromancer wrote:I'm not sure sticks float on water.
Most wood floats.
To be honest, whether or not sticks float, I really like the look of them on the water. Makes the water look more natural. I'd like to see more dirty water as well.

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by Mossmanikin » Post

Neuromancer wrote:Something about the twigs bothered me. The fact that they were all perfectly centered in the node just looked fake to me. So I slid them over to the edge of the node. I was hoping to get the effect of multiple twigs joined together to make one large twig. Instead what I got was what looked like a long twig that got stepped on an broken, but still a cool effect. And not so centered on the node they look more natural. But I also got 2 random pixels on the sides of the nodes. At first I thought this looked bad like a glitch, but when approaching the twigs from far away, it looks like all kinds of random natural twig debris on the ground. Try it out. Change the texture names to use the 3 "e" textures e.g. trunks_twig_1e. I'm not saying this is perfect, some glitches need to be ironed out, but I really like the look of it! Try it out, start wandering around seeing all the random debris on the ground and let me know what you think.
Feel free to add what you've done so far. :)
Just change textures/code, we can always roll back to a previous version in case it doesn't work.

I'm busy doing stuff not related to minetest at the moment, so I'll probably not add anything the following couple of days.

Generally I'd say: the three of us just add and change stuff if we think it's a good idea, and in case it turns out it wasn't, well, we still have the older version, right?

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