Minetest Privacy Policy

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Minetest Privacy Policy

by rubenwardy » Post

Hi everyone,

We've created a privacy policy for the Minetest application. This applies to both desktop and mobile builds.

Read it here: https://www.minetest.net/app-privacy-policy/

Please comment below or in private if you have any questions or concerns
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by rob123 » Post

whats personnel info. Can you add what actually sfarn5 has access to.
If my post says something, it is a opinion and not fact unless i say so

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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by LMD » Post

rob123 wrote:
Mon May 15, 2023 05:38
whats personnel info. Can you add what actually sfarn5 has access to.
sfan5 only has access to what your browser / Minetest choose to send. This of course includes your IP address and usually your User Agent (which often includes information such as which Minetest version / Browser version / OS). I wouldn't really call this "personal information".
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by rubenwardy » Post

rob123 wrote:
Mon May 15, 2023 05:38
whats personnel info. Can you add what actually sfarn5 has access to.
The personal information is in the "what information" section, and is basically just IP address in this case, I'll add a note to clarify this (it's not really personal information in this situation)
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Festus1965 » Post

Mal für Deutschland:
https://wwwschutz.de/blog/urteil-ip-adr ... ene-daten/
Bereits 2017 entschied der BGH, dass IP-Adressen als personenbezogene Daten anzusehen sind. Aus dieser Einschätzung erwachsen für die Betreiber von Webseiten eine ganze Reihe großer Herausforderungen.
IP-Adressen als personenbezogene Daten

Gemäß § 3 Abs. 1 des Bundesdatenschutzgesetzes (BDSG) sind personenbezogene Daten "Einzelangaben über persönliche oder sachliche Verhältnisse einer bestimmten oder bestimmbaren natürlichen Person (Betroffener)." Eine ähnliche Regelung findet sich in Art. 2 Buchstabe a der EG-Datenschutzrichtlinie 95/46/EG, den der EuGH hier auszulegen hatte.
So that is also for the EU !

https://privacylaw.proskauer.com/2016/1 ... sometimes/
EU Court Rules that Dynamic IP Addresses are Personal Data…Sometimes
By Courtney M. Bowman on November 8, 2016

On October 19, the Court of Justice of the European Union (CJEU) ruled that dynamic IP addresses may qualify as “personal data” under EU privacy law. As we covered here on the blog a few months ago, this decision is significant because it clarifies that companies that collect, store, process, and/or transfer dynamic IP addresses belonging to EU users ...
The problem is the saving, storage of this data - not the usage, as then no internet works at all.
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Festus1965 » Post

rob123 wrote:
Mon May 15, 2023 05:38
whats personnel info. Can you add what actually sfarn5 has access to.
the main personal info meaning as of this problem is
to be able to detect one single special person out of the collected data:
* the IP-address itself will not do this - as randomly chosen out of range used for several costumer at that ISP

* but a time stamp to an IP address then allows to research the user via ISP request, what is limited to judge, etc.

* if there are more data collected that together even without an timestamp are leading to ONE absolute single PC config then this should also go to personal data rule, think about cookies etc.

ok, if a server admin complain about an Thai IP-address it MIGHT look like it can 'only' be me, but that is human thinking, and even also same ISP and range makes it NOT sure yet !
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Astrobe » Post

Platform, OS, device, etc
You should not "etc" here.
By using this service, you give permission for the data to be moved as needed.
Moved to.. where? As the service is currently under EU laws, I think it would be better to state that it will stay in EU, or else people can imagine that someday it will be moved to Singapore, and that's a whole different story.
Logged HTTP requests are stored using log rotation, meaning that any requests will be forgotten within a few weeks.
This is too vague. I have a pretty good idea of what you mean by "log rotation", and indeed this scheme limits the size of the logs, not their time span. A little extra (daily cron job ;-) to delete log files with an access time older that 3 months would allow you to state clearly that they have a max retention time like in the rest of the document.

That's for the fun of nitpicking anyway. Nice to see MT is getting more and more serious.
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by ROllerozxa » Post

Astrobe wrote:
Mon May 15, 2023 08:55
Platform, OS, device, etc
You should not "etc" here.
Yes, probably should be more specific. While browser user agents in general are unpredictable in the data they may contain (imagine leaking IMEIs via user agents!), for the Minetest client (which this privacy policy is intended to cover) they are more predictable. Just from some UAs I could obtain real quick:

Code: Select all

Linux:
Minetest/5.7.0-rollerozxa-952c90b69 (Linux/6.3.1-arch1-1 x86_64)

Windows:
Minetest/5.6.1 (Windows/10.0.18362 x86_64)

Android:
Minetest/2023.4.9 (Linux/4.19.157-perf aarch64)
A reasonable guess at the OS can be made. On Linux-based distros it will show the kernel version, on Windows it will show the build number. The architecture is shown, and VERSION_EXTRA is included with the Minetest version (along with a git hash if -dev).

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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by mtvisitor » Post

Congratulations for the version 1.0 in revision.
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Linuxdirk » Post

mtvisitor wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 08:07
Congratulations for the version 1.0 in revision.
It still says "etc" and "a few weeks", though.

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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by rubenwardy » Post

Here's a PR to update based on feedback: https://github.com/minetest/minetest.github.io/pull/282

Please take a look and make sure you get any comments in soon, as I don't want to update the privacy policy too often (as it requires making a post on the forums each time)
Astrobe wrote:
Mon May 15, 2023 08:55
This is too vague. I have a pretty good idea of what you mean by "log rotation", and indeed this scheme limits the size of the logs, not their time span. A little extra (daily cron job ;-) to delete log files with an access time older that 3 months would allow you to state clearly that they have a max retention time like in the rest of the document.
By a few weeks, I meant 3 weeks. I use time-based logged rotation, logs are deleted after 10 days. I'll edit this to say "Logged HTTP requests are automatically deleted within 2 weeks."
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Linuxdirk » Post

But what did “etc.” stand for? It was removed without replacement. And with the removal of “etc.” it was also removed that the device is logged.

According to the updated policy instead of the platform, the OS, the device, and whatever “etc” was referring to, now only the platform and OS are logged?

As a legal text it should be as exact as possible.

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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by rubenwardy » Post

Linuxdirk wrote:
Fri Jun 02, 2023 02:44
But what did “etc.” stand for? It was removed without replacement. And with the removal of “etc.” it was also removed that the device is logged.

According to the updated policy instead of the platform, the OS, the device, and whatever “etc” was referring to, now only the platform and OS are logged?

As a legal text it should be as exact as possible.
etc stood for nothing, it was redundant. The device (ie: model) is also not logged. See ROllerozxa's post for examples, perhaps I should add one to the policy:
11.22.33.44 content.minetest.net - [02/Jun/2023:10:05:00 +0200] "GET /packages/Wuzzy/glitch/releases/18414/download/?reason=new HTTP/2.0" 302 233 "-" "Minetest/5.7.0 (Linux/6.1.31-1-MANJARO x86_64)" 0.014
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Linuxdirk » Post

Ah, then it’s better now :)

An example (with a non-existent package and username of course) to clarify what exactly is logged would be good for further understanding, yes.

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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Astrobe » Post

rubenwardy wrote:
Thu Jun 01, 2023 23:16
Here's a PR to update based on feedback: https://github.com/minetest/minetest.github.io/pull/282

Please take a look and make sure you get any comments in soon, as I don't want to update the privacy policy too often (as it requires making a post on the forums each time)
Glad to help here.

Another unclear term I overlooked is "platform". Based on Rollerozxa's comment and yours, I can only guess that it is the "processor type" (aarch64, x86_64...).
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by MCL » Post

I don't get what the point of this is.
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by rubenwardy » Post

MCL wrote:
Mon Sep 18, 2023 23:05
I don't get what the point of this is.
It's a legal requirement

https://support.google.com/googleplay/a ... etysection
https://gdpr-info.eu/
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by MCL » Post

rubenwardy wrote:
Mon Sep 18, 2023 23:10
MCL wrote:
Mon Sep 18, 2023 23:05
I don't get what the point of this is.
It's a legal requirement

https://support.google.com/googleplay/a ... etysection
https://gdpr-info.eu/
Oh, so it's for Google Play; makes sense now
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Nininik » Post

I kinda feel unsafe about the ip part....
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by ROllerozxa » Post

Nininik wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2023 01:02
I kinda feel unsafe about the ip part....
Any website you connect to will have access to the IP address you connected with. That's just how the Internet works.

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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Nininik » Post

Yeah, and ip = location
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Festus1965 » Post

Nininik wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2023 23:53
Yeah, and ip = location
NO, only the IP gives not the full location, and special NOT the user.
It only leads to a IP-range rented by a ISP and used for much more people contract there, switching them all 24 hours (at most ISP).
So I get country (that I might see also by minetest client settings) or the favorite language and the area, most near the towns, the ISP has its registered company location. NOT more.

You need at least also the time that IP was connected, THEN you get the user you need the allowance (via court) to ask the ISP for the contract partner = the person, the house.

And this is why storing only 3 of 4 octets like 192.168.1.x is enough also for a minetest server security, as there are so less minetest player that the change to hit two player NOT from same family with just one octet missing is near 0, when block that range as of bad bahavior, stealing etc.

= Even European law is enforced but nothing lost in our servers security.
AND still same kind of detecting : without the timestamp you only get the ISP and the ISP location with still possible thousands of users.
AND even WITH the timestamp or range you don't get the user (contractor) just for fun.


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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by rubenwardy » Post

Nininik wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2023 23:53
Yeah, and ip = location
This is incorrect. IP can give you the nearest city at best, a completely wrong location at worst
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by MCL » Post

rubenwardy wrote:
Thu Sep 21, 2023 10:44
Nininik wrote:
Wed Sep 20, 2023 23:53
Yeah, and ip = location
This is incorrect. IP can give you the nearest city at best, a completely wrong location at worst
That is not entirely correct, as in some rare cases a geolocation lookup can return coordinates within a 2 minute drive of where you are located.
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Re: Minetest Privacy Policy

by Festus1965 » Post

MCL wrote:
Fri Sep 22, 2023 01:55
within a 2 minute drive of where you are located.
EV 15y car with 45 km/h max (1.5 km) or Lamborghini with 300 km/h (10 km) - joke.
And it depends also of the dentisy of the people living there. For a farmer alone different as for a location center town.
Anywhere, even if I know the ISP, how should I see that from outside ? maybe follow the open cable from last 'named' location.
So far I don't know a event, someone was found like that.
The more easy it seam to be combine several known facts for this 'person' and search social media ?
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