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Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 16:18
by TumeniNodes
Sergey wrote:
TumeniNodes wrote:Mesetopia
I don't like word "Mese" at all. I don't even know how to pronounce it correctly.
I think it is pronounced the same as geese
but I pronounce it as messy.
Sergey wrote:
TumeniNodes wrote:Mesetopia
Anyway it sounds... weird... not funny (like one finnish guy said)... it is weird, not usual for tongue in my mouth. IDK, I don't like this word.
Finnish guy? Are you referring to celeron55?

I am just going by my own feelings that it would be lame and doing just the same as literally every other similar game has done, by feeling locked into using words such as voxel, cube, block, mine, craft, etc...
Based on the facts that anyone who sees it is already going to know the game involves those things, as no matter what MT does, it will always be labelled as "A Minecraft-like Game" everywhere it is promoted.

In these two names I am suggesting, the word mese is pronounced as mesa (like meta) only without the ta :P

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 16:28
by ABJ
We could name it Mese.
That's pretty short and IMO sweet..

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 17:01
by MineYoshi
ABJ wrote:We could name it Mese.
That's pretty short and IMO sweet..
Let's name it: "OpenMese". Or maybe "MNM" after all Minetest's Not Minecraft ;) -Using a name likely GNU, with a hidden abbreviation, would be a very good detail -

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 17:03
by ABJ
No. OpenMese sounds horrible. And MNM? Sorta.......unnecessary.

Just my 2c.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 17:06
by Sergey
MineYoshi wrote:
ABJ wrote:We could name it Mese.
That's pretty short and IMO sweet..
Let's name it: "OpenMese". Or maybe "MNM" after all Minetest's Not Minecraft ;) -Using a name likely GNU, with a hidden abbreviation, would be a very good detail -
MNM ?

I even know how to pronounce that!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8N_tupPBtWQ

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 17:09
by ABJ
Screw it Sergey, cough it up. Do you still not know how to pronounce Mese?

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 17:34
by TumeniNodes
I think even adding reference to the name regarding open or free is redundant..., again.

I think MNM is pronounced: Mahna mahna...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTXyXuqfBLA

edit: had the same idea as Sergey

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 17:56
by Sergey
ABJ wrote:Do you still not know how to pronounce Mese?
Transcription, please.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Thu Apr 13, 2017 18:05
by ABJ
It is pronounced meese.

Also, can people please stop with the references? Not everyone understands them, and writing something offensive without knowing it is too likely.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 19:14
by MineYoshi
"MNM" stands for "MNM's not Minecraft"
Maybe calling the game VEG (Voxel Exploration Game) or WOV(World Of Voxels) can be a good idea?

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 19:44
by azekill_DIABLO
we should avoid acronyms IMHO

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 19:45
by Sergey
azekill_DIABLO wrote:we should avoid acronyms IMHO
+1

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 19:46
by azekill_DIABLO
1 more vote and it will be equality between opinions :)

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 22:28
by benrob0329
How about no.

Breaking every mod and changing every domain (and github repository!) Would only cause confusion, and pain. Trust me when I say, no.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 22:54
by TumeniNodes
Party pooper...

Breaking stuff is fun though..., I do it all the time. :D

As far as I am concerned, "if" it were to happen..., it would be a discussion not even due until about the 1.0.0 mark.
And probably best done separately from the existing minetest game.

Starting fresh.

Might sound dumb but it makes sense. No reason to kill off minetest game..., just offer up a better "official" game for the engine, with a better name.

Either way, the name makes zero difference to me, and I am not concerned with how many people use it... I know that I like it, so does my kid, and a few of his friends use it now too.
I simply work on my own version as a subgame and tweak it to what I like, and even get to pick the name :D

But, at the same time, I do realize that as far as promotional purposes... the current name sucks onions.
Even calling it "The Game" would be a huge improvement.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 03:00
by MineYoshi
benrob0329 wrote:How about no.

Breaking every mod and changing every domain (and github repository!) Would only cause confusion, and pain. Trust me when I say, no.
If the developers make an alias in the source code if they change the name of this game, the number of breaking 3rd party code and mods would be very low even near to 0.
Maybe the only problem would be with the fact of getting a new domain for the game website. and that maybe some people would not find the game, maybe if you add a way to redirect from "Minetest" to "SuperNewGameName" it would be easier.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 09:00
by ABJ
I still support Mese. That is, it we do rename.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 10:02
by rubenwardy
benrob0329 wrote:How about no.

Breaking every mod and changing every domain (and github repository!) Would only cause confusion, and pain. Trust me when I say, no.
Exactly 0 mods would be broken.
Domains and github's can be redirected

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 20:40
by MineYoshi
ABJ wrote:I still support Mese. That is, it we do rename.
"Mesecolonia" looks good.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 20:53
by Sergey
MineYoshi wrote:
ABJ wrote:I still support Mese. That is, it we do rename.
"Mesecolonia" looks good.
It is awful!

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 21:59
by echosa
I agree that we should avoid the word "mese". It's already confusing in the game itself. Meece? Meecy? Messy? Meekee? If Minetest is renamed, it should be something easy, unambiguous, and catchy.

Again, though, are we (potentially) renaming the engine? Or Minetest Game? Or both?

If the engine was only that - just the engine - then it could stay named whatever. No one cares what the Unreal Engine is named. Users/gamers/players don't search for and download "Unreal Engine" or "Unreal" (at least, not anymore… RIP Unreal Tournament). They download a game that uses that engine. If that were the case here, then the engine could stay "Minetest" and each game could have its own name and come bundled with the engine, seamless and invisible to the end user. (I'd be cool with this approach, actually. There's a few issues, though, outlined below.)

However, Minetest is not just the engine, but also the launcher/configuration manager/settings GUI, etc. Therefore, people *do* search for and download "Minetest", *then* (optionally, but usually) go download an actual (sub)game to play (unless they stick with just Minetest Game, which is unlikely). The name Minetest is first and foremost what potential players see and hear… and it's not good. It really does sound like a pet project, a hobby, not something to be taken too seriously. First impressions are important. The name "Minetest" isn't a great first impression.

To help counter that on my end these days, when I stream or talk about my game, I say things like "I'm playing my Minetest game: 'Boldly Go'". This conveys several things:

1.) This is something I made/put together. (The subgame Boldly Go.)
2.) This is a game I made with an existing engine/framework. (Minetest)
3.) The actual name of my game is "Boldly Go", not "Minetest" (even though the stream says "Playing Minetest", etc.)
4.) It helps introduce the idea of Minetest just being the engine/host/launcher/etc, so if anyone downloads it, they understand the difference between Minetest and all the actual games (Minetest Game, Boldly Go, etc).

That said, I can think of two potential solutions to discuss.

1.) Rename "Minetest" to "Minetest Launcher". We keep the existing name and familiarity we already have, but also add a clarification of what the software actually is and how it is supposed to be used. In this case, I don't think having "Minetest" as part of the name is an issue. Minetest Launcher is no sillier than ATLauncher, FTB, etc.

2.) I like the idea of possibly moving away from the single launcher for all games and moving towards individually bundled games. If a user wants to play Minetest Game, they download Minetest Game and play it (which would include everything bundled). If a user wants to play my Boldly Go game, they would download that and play it. No reason to know about the engine. No need for a launcher. No need to market the engine/launcher/etc. This has the downside of possible wasted drive space, since each game would have its own copy of the engine. However, this is offset by the fact that if a game is developed for 0.4.13, that game will ship with 0.4.13 ready to run. You won't have to worry about mod/game/engine version incompatibilities.

The main downside to option #2 is that players lose the ability to easily just add their own mods to a blank slate to create their own game/experience. That's a pretty big downside, but could possibly be rectified with Minetest Minimal Game being developed/released specifically as a game meant for customization. That way, subgame developers can develop and release their own games in individual apps/bundles, while there'd still be a app/bundle specifically for user modification.

The second downside to option #2 is: subgame developers would be in charge of developing/releasing their game for each OS, etc. That's a lot of work and a lot of redundancy.

So, for all the benefits of #2, I'd say option #1 is better. It's easy (simply rename the user downloaded software to "Minetest Launcher" or similar, while the engine could still be "Minetest"). It clarifies what the software the user just downloaded is and gets the point across that it, itself, isn't a game. This alone would improve user experience and comprehension of Minetest. Even better would be an in-game built-in subgame search and installer, similar to FTB/ATLauncher/etc. It would be so nice if someone could simply download Minetest Launcher, install it, run it, search for a game, click install, the launcher downloads and installs, then the user can play. Seamless experience, without having to traverse the Games forum area.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 07:37
by Lone_Wolf
Keep the name!!!
Minetest may sound silly like Wuzzy said but isn't the NyanCat too?

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 07:48
by Lone_Wolf
rubenwardy wrote:The name simply makes our project sound shit to outsiders
If you mean the current name then your most likely wrong, when I first saw this game I skipped over it because of the logo. I sadly hadn't learnt the: "Don't judge a book by its' cover" saying yet...
If we do change the name though (HIGHLY unlikely) I would go for: 'Rabid Digger' or 'Rabid Miner'

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 09:11
by ABJ
Lone Wolf, not any opinion on the subject, but Nyan Cat is a freaking meme. It's a rainbow-shitting cat that says "Nyan" for how ever long you dare to make a youtube video.

Re: Should we rename Minetest? (poll)

Posted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 09:52
by Linuxdirk
echosa wrote:1.) Rename "Minetest" to "Minetest Launcher". We keep the existing name and familiarity we already have, but also add a clarification of what the software actually is and how it is supposed to be used. In this case, I don't think having "Minetest" as part of the name is an issue. Minetest Launcher is no sillier than ATLauncher, FTB, etc.
I fully agree. Make clear that the currently named "Minetest Game" game and the launcher are two different things. Make clear that people understand that the launcher is exactly that: a launcher (and configuration/management interface) for different Minetest Engine based games like the bundled Minetest Game.
echosa wrote:2.) I like the idea of possibly moving away from the single launcher for all games and moving towards individually bundled games.
Keep the launcher as it is and allow people to create mods and subgames as they want without having to care about shipping a version of the Minetest Engine in form of the Minetest Launcher probably causing a shit-ton of compatibility and security issues.