The core team might think about theese things ...

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Festus1965
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The core team might think about theese things ...

by Festus1965 » Post

I am sitting about 12 hours a day at my PC, watching also the terminal of the server ...
and ...

* there are still a lot of "mismatches clients try to connect"
==> fail of the idea to let all older protocol still be in same list, or let them show on diff clients

* the next similar strong group are "supplies empty password"
==> fail of a clear and secure offered login process - newer use or play without password

* the idea of a game that still works on older slow hardware
==> about 50% of those managing the right version and use a password are just lost during the loading process ... and don't reach the game getting a "***gamer joined "
(on my about 4-5 year phone also the app fails)

added later:
* the difference from load/join into a server with linux based client (= fast) or windows client (3*times longer) ... maybe based on the stats about how much gamer using windows to focus on something clear different


have fun about this, before continue other things like graphic rework, or mods ... as the most gamer might not be able to enjoy this, as don't reach the game anyway.
Last edited by Festus1965 on Sun Aug 23, 2020 02:58, edited 1 time in total.
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Mineminer
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Mineminer » Post

Festus1965 wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 23:23
I am sitting about 12 hours a day at my PC, watching also the terminal of the server ...
and ...

* there are still a lot of "mismatches clients try to connect"
==> fail of the idea to let all older protocol still be in same list, or let them show on diff clients

* the next similar strong group are "supplies empty password"
==> fail of a clear and secure offered login process - newer use or play without password

* the idea of a game that still works on older slow hardware
==> about 50% of those managing the right version and use a password are just lost during the loading process ... and don't reach the game getting a "***gamer joined "
(on my about 4-5 year phone also the app fails)

have fun about this, before continue other things like graphic rework, or mods ... as the most gamer might not be able to enjoy this, as don't reach the game anyway.


Everything but the first point is steer user sided. If the server tells you that you can't use empty password then it's up the user to listen/read that. Not anybody else problems.

Same for having responsible connectivity and/or equipment that can handle a connection any more than a 64K modern...

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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Festus1965 » Post

Mineminer wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 23:42
If the server tells you that you can't use empty password then it's up the user to listen/read that. Not anybody else problems.
In our times there should no game exist that allow non password. That is core problem, decision.

I was 3 years security teacher in my army. That is already 20 years ago, and we still work like this ? oh oh

Mineminer wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 23:42
Same for having responsible connectivity and/or equipment that can handle a connection any more than a 64K modern...
Nope, as
* the game is supposed to run on older hardware ... what also contain the options
* the server list is sorted by gamer count, but to make sure gamer first look for nearby servers to reduce the problem of far distance and so maybe also slow loading, the servers NEED to be sorted in order of local ping.
If THEN still the clients hardware is too slow ... the idea of app running on older hardware, failed.
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Mineminer » Post

Festus1965 wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 00:21
Mineminer wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 23:42
If the server tells you that you can't use empty password then it's up the user to listen/read that. Not anybody else problems.
In our times there should no game exist that allow non password. That is core problem, decision.

I was 3 years security teacher in my army. That is already 20 years ago, and we still work like this ? oh oh

I understand your frustrations now that you explained what you meant to help me understand better. :)

Though it's have it's values... What if your running a non persistent server like a Capture the Flag or similar Mini Game server that will only lasts for that session? Or a "fan made" Twitch instance for an hour/day for the Twitch Steam? Do you really wanna frustrate these operators of such deployments? By slowing people down of having to password protect accounts that will have little if any values at all?

As for
Nope, as
* the game is supposed to run on older hardware ... what also contain the options
* the server list is sorted by gamer count, but to make sure gamer first look for nearby servers to reduce the problem of far distance and so maybe also slow loading, the servers NEED to be sorted in order of local ping.


Thanks again for helping me understand since I totally agrees. However...
If THEN still the clients hardware is too slow ... the idea of app running on older hardware, failed.

I sure there servers that set the BW threshold low enough for low end clients to connect. There even a server powered by a flipping old phone by that Pentium44 person. I sure something like that would work or some Raspberry Pi based servers.

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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Festus1965 » Post

Mineminer wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 01:36
By slowing people down of having to password protect accounts that will have little if any values at all?
omG, internet security is seen like his ... something take me 3 sec to type in ?
Even i log in my PCs with PW (even 3 diff logins, rules = each other PW), also my daughter (now 10) is forced to use it !

When you see this like this, I sure can ignore your further posts about this.
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Mineminer » Post

Festus1965 wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 01:55
Mineminer wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 01:36
By slowing people down of having to password protect accounts that will have little if any values at all?
omG, internet security is seen like his ... something take me 3 sec to type in ?
Even i log in my PCs with PW (even 3 diff logins, rules = each other PW), also my daughter (now 10) is forced to use it !

When you see this like this, I sure can ignore your further posts about this.

It's basically negligible is what I am saying. It's one thing if you got builds, relationships and so on to secure on a persistent server. But if you wanna paintball with someone? Are you really expecting that to be password protected?

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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Festus1965 » Post

Mineminer wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 01:36
Do you really wanna frustrate these operators of such deployments? By slowing people down of having to password protect accounts that will have little if any values at all?
and I guess this people are playing on Android (slowest) and windows (slow) loading and mind about that part of time (password)
ROFL
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Pyrollo » Post

Festus1965 wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 00:21
In our times there should no game exist that allow non password. That is core problem, decision.
That's true only if you speak about online game servers. That's not true if you play in a class room, with a local server and young children playing on it. Making password mandatory will lower versatility of this game. There could be other solutions, like having an optional empty password check in main menu according to server announce (thought there were one).
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Mineminer » Post

Pyrollo wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 10:54
Festus1965 wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 00:21
In our times there should no game exist that allow non password. That is core problem, decision.
That's true only if you speak about online game servers. That's not true if you play in a class room, with a local server and young children playing on it. Making password mandatory will lower versatility of this game.

Exactly, security should only be implemented if it really calls for and the inconvenience factor is accounted for. As I said for non persistent "on demand" online gaming it may not be worthwhile, especially as you mentioned if you got an audience where entering a password appears to be a chore to them (even if really isn't as adults).

On "everyday" persistent servers, I agree that disallowing password is crucial given then your generally are securing builds, in game and/or life relationships (if permissible by the server in question) , etc.

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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Zughy » Post

Festus1965 wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 23:23
have fun about this, before continue other things like graphic rework, or mods ... as the most gamer might not be able to enjoy this, as don't reach the game anyway.
Well, graphical rework is also design rework. So yeah, I'll consider these points when I design the multiplayer section, thanks

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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Festus1965 » Post

empty password warning
was shown another +10 times today,

I fear even most gamer even don't understand what that meant ... as
* most try only one time
* some stuck at this issue about 5-10 times in a row ...

= the case seam not to be clear for the user ... when try the same case 10 times in a row ... misunderstanding, misleading ... miss informative ?
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Mineminer » Post

Festus1965 wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 12:51
empty password warning
was shown another +10 times today,

I fear even most gamer even don't understand what that meant ... as
* most try only one time
* some stuck at this issue about 5-10 times in a row ...

More than likely it's non native person connecting to a improper server. We would get that a lot until we literally spelled it out to them that we would like them to speak English in our server spawn.

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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Festus1965 » Post

Mineminer wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 13:35
More than likely it's non native person connecting to a improper server. We would get that a lot until we literally spelled it out to them that we would like them to speak English in our server spawn.
so I read out of your post
* there are bots
* this bots might search only for non password server ... to make what they are programmed for ???
* this gamer or bots are not even able to understand about #main language
(but for the last option are two easy solutions =>
* /revoke gamer shout
* take [mod] beerchat, and force this gamer into another channel, like #spammer, #ukl (unknown language) or that one it is #ru, #po, #es, ... #wtfun)
I practice successful, but revoke shout is the easiest ... before I use /euban

But IF your right about likely not human ... then we would need an human verification now, ==> hey core devs, have fun !

and isn't a password likely as a human verification ?

I am looking forward to check about the top 50 servers about password or not ...
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Mineminer » Post

Festus1965 wrote:
Mon Aug 24, 2020 01:10
Mineminer wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 13:35
More than likely it's non native person connecting to a improper server. We would get that a lot until we literally spelled it out to them that we would like them to speak English in our server spawn.
so I read out of your post
* this gamer or bots are not even able to understand about #main language

That is what I meant and to me it's up to the gamers and such to understand what's going on. If it not in their native language then it is assumed it's not "supported", can't be moderated, etc.

Anyways that's getting into offtopic but I meant to clarifies what i meant. So I will leave it at that.

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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by The32bitguy » Post

Festus1965 wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 00:21
If THEN still the clients hardware is too slow ... the idea of app running on older hardware, failed.
You have no idea of what you are talking about. If Minetest does not run well on your 100 dollar budget celeron laptop from 2016 then nothing can be done, the CPU and GPU are simply too weak and were mostly likely crippled further by the OEM for power efficiency. Pentium 4 HTs run minetest great for what they are. Certainly better performance than Minecraft so your point is invalid unless your criteria cover hardware older than 2006~

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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Festus1965 » Post

minetest wikipedia:
Das Spiel wurde 2010 unter der Leitung von Perttu Ahola (alias „celeron55“) entwickelt und seitdem mit Hilfe einer wachsenden Community weiterentwickelt.
So started 2010, and made for also older hardware = sure including 2006 or more, depending on the definition of older ? .

Ah I forgot, a mobile-phone 6 month old might be old already ...
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by Festus1965 » Post

so, I use another solution not getting that "empty password" message
I set a default_password, and don't tell it somewhere.
Now the message is "supplied wrong password" ... weird uh ? rofl
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by waldberg » Post

Festus1965 wrote:
Tue Aug 25, 2020 08:30
minetest wikipedia:
Das Spiel wurde 2010 unter der Leitung von Perttu Ahola (alias „celeron55“) entwickelt und seitdem mit Hilfe einer wachsenden Community weiterentwickelt.
So started 2010, and made for also older hardware = sure including 2006 or more, depending on the definition of older ? .
In my estimation there is actually given a wrong date (2010) on Wikipedia. Rather it was earlier.
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Re: The core team might think about theese things ...

by rubenwardy » Post

2010 is correct. However, note that the definition of "older device" changes over time

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