Using Minecraft Features

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12Me21
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by 12Me21 » Post

I wish that it was easier to find crafting recipies, like have a book of recipies in the inventory (separate from your inventory where you keep stuff, and you click on it and it shows all the crafting recipies) I know there is a mod, but it would be nice if it came as a default.
Crafting recipie for book:
P = paper
W = wood planks

W P W
W P W
W P W
Shoutouts to Simpleflips

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10twenty4
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by 10twenty4 » Post

But how would we know how to create the recipe book without the recipe book to show us the recipe?

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jojoa1997
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by jojoa1997 » Post

then we get it when the world starts
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by Splizard » Post

The people I know who do not like Minetest complain that it is a copy of Minecraft and then criticize it for not having the same features as minecraft eg. workbenches... -.-
(you can't win)
Last edited by Splizard on Wed Mar 20, 2013 03:28, edited 1 time in total.
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Chinchow
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by Chinchow » Post

Says Minetest is a Minecraft clone.
Complains that Minetest doesn't have things Minecraft has.
Intelligence.
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Linxx
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by Linxx » Post

12Me21 wrote:I wish that it was easier to find crafting recipies, like have a book of recipies in the inventory (separate from your inventory where you keep stuff, and you click on it and it shows all the crafting recipies) I know there is a mod, but it would be nice if it came as a default.
Crafting recipie for book:
P = paper
W = wood planks

W P W
W P W
W P W
what about having an empty book with the recipes already in but with no names? that would make the player to have unlock the names to see what it is

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0gb.us
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by 0gb.us » Post

I think a better option than a craftable book would be an in-menu crafting guide. RealBadAngel has a great example of what that might look like. However, maybe the "g" key should open up the craft guide page. Of course, that would require engine work, so maybe not.

Then again, it might make it easier to implement that idea of "unlocking" the names via having actually crafted said items. It wouldn't really detract from the game in any way, but would give players one more thing to work toward.

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by Jordach » Post

Umm, everybody here should sit down and chill. Minecrap features are pretty crap IMHO, quit complaining if PilzAdam adds something because down the line you will end up liking it. See Mese crystals issue a few months back.
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by 0gb.us » Post

Jordach wrote:Umm, everybody here should sit down and chill. Minecrap features are pretty crap IMHO, quit complaining if PilzAdam adds something because down the line you will end up liking it. See Mese crystals issue a few months back.
Quick question. Is there anyone who was actually opposed to mese crystals, but likes them now? I don't know anyone who was opposed, and isn't still at least disappointed. The apparent "mese crystals are okay now" is likely coming from the fact that most people wanted them, combined with the fact that they already went stable, so there was no longer a point for those that didn't want them to keep fighting. After all, it's too late at this point to undo mese crystals.

The exception being me, as my problem with them was the mese + stone == ore recipe. Once that was removed, I quit fighting. But it wasn't that I suddenly "saw the light that is mese crystals", it's that they actually fixed what was my issue with them.

Note, my issue here is that a cap is being imposed on our once-limitless lava. I don't really care if obsidian stays or goes, I just want our easy to use lava back. If obsidian is what's keeping us from our lava, then it is the enemy in my eyes. But if there is a way we can have both, that's just as well. To be clear, it's the cap on our lava that is the lame feature from Minecraft, not the obsidian.
Last edited by 0gb.us on Wed Mar 20, 2013 08:17, edited 1 time in total.

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by Dopium » Post

Who really cares if Minecrafters think Minetest is a copy, aslong as the game is fun to play is the way i see it. To be honest i actually dont really like that some want change minetest so much, that it wont even be anything like Minecraft. If the game goes in a completely different direction i will most likely switch to Minecraft. Like i have said before im sure many Minetest players were actually looking for a Minecraft type game and c++ preferred over java. Not saying anyone has to make it the same but once alot of the Minecraft features are pushed away id say alot of the community will move on. Back when i played Minetest 0.3 even the developers said it was a clone because they wanted it written in c++. So why did this outlook change.....
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by Gambit » Post

Usually it's like this:

If Minetest doesn't have something Minecraft has, their argument is: "This game sucks, it can't even do the same things as Minecraft. If you're going to clone a game, at least try to copy everything."

If Minetest has the same features as Minecraft, their argument is: "Look, water flows just like in Minecraft. These people can't think of their own ideas? Why can't these developers be original?"

If Minetest has a feature that's better then what Minecraft has, their argument is: "Oh I guess that's pretty cool but who really needs this kind of feature? Developers are only making the game more complicated than it should."

That's the gist of arguments from Minecrafters. They're free to have their own opinion. I'll just leave it at that.


As for Mese Crystals, I really don't see much of a problem. I thinks it's the shard that is going just a little to far. I don't really understand the need of even smaller bits of Mese at all. I feel it just an extension of an already overpowered ore. Mese is going to needs a equally powerful ore to compete with it eventually.
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by Mito551 » Post

Chinchow wrote:Says Minetest is a Minecraft clone.
Complains that Minetest doesn't have things Minecraft has.
Intelligence.
looks like a haiku :D
Gambit wrote:Usually it's like this:

If Minetest doesn't have something Minecraft has, their argument is: "This game sucks, it can't even do the same things as Minecraft. If you're going to clone a game, at least try to copy everything."

If Minetest has the same features as Minecraft, their argument is: "Look, water flows just like in Minecraft. These people can't think of their own ideas? Why can't these developers be original?"
That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.
Gambit wrote:If Minetest has a feature that's better then what Minecraft has, their argument is: "Oh I guess that's pretty cool but who really needs this kind of feature? Developers are only making the game more complicated than it should."
this argument is plain stupid. (i know it isn't yours, still)
Last edited by Mito551 on Wed Mar 20, 2013 11:27, edited 1 time in total.

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by PilzAdam » Post

Mito551 wrote:That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.
Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.

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by nomohakon » Post

PilzAdam wrote:
Mito551 wrote:That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.
Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.
Not enough.
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by Mito551 » Post

nomohakon wrote:
PilzAdam wrote:
Mito551 wrote:That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.
Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.
Not enough.

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by 0gb.us » Post

nomohakon wrote:
PilzAdam wrote:
Mito551 wrote:That's where minetest developers have to be creative: implement minecraft features in a minetest-exclusive way.
Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.
Not enough.
Not enough? Maybe if we didn't make lava finite like in Minecraft, it would be different enough ...

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by Mito551 » Post

0gb.us wrote:
nomohakon wrote:
PilzAdam wrote: Thats a good idea. This is also what I tried with obsidian. The generation is same as in MC, but you can craft shards and cook glass out of them. This is something that MC doesnt have.
Not enough.
Not enough? Maybe if we didn't make lava finite like in Minecraft, it would be different enough ...
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by tinoesroho » Post

Linxx wrote:
12Me21 wrote:I wish that it was easier to find crafting recipies, like have a book of recipies in the inventory (separate from your inventory where you keep stuff, and you click on it and it shows all the crafting recipies) I know there is a mod, but it would be nice if it came as a default.
Crafting recipie for book:
P = paper
W = wood planks

W P W
W P W
W P W
what about having an empty book with the recipes already in but with no names? that would make the player to have unlock the names to see what it is
+1
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by onpon4 » Post

Let me throw in my two cents:

I've never played Minecraft and never will because I refuse to use nonfree software (where "free" refers to freedom, not price). My brother has, and does, though. He first tried Minetest because he had heard from me that it is a clone of Minecraft and wanted to see how it is. Since he was downloading from Linux Mint's repos, he was playing 0.3.1, but he had a good experience; he expressed surprise that the game was actually a pretty decent clone. He introduced it to me, and we played it. We haven't played in a while, but as far as I can tell, his overall impression of the game so far is positive, and I think he would play it as often as Minecraft if his friends were playing it, too.

Point is, I really don't think Minetest needs to avoid being like Minecraft. In fact, I think being like Minecraft is an asset: it makes it easier for Minecraft players to jump right in, like my brother did. Sure, some people will complain that the game isn't "original", but people will complain either way, and of course, there's always mods.

Actually, maybe it's just me, but I think this game has an incredibly steep learning curve for someone who isn't familiar with Minecraft. I say this because, when I first saw the game, I was dumbfounded by the inventory screen; I only understood it when I played with my brother for the first time and he explained that the cube of 9 squares was used to "craft" things (from the appearance, I had assumed that it was mere inventory space), and he also helped with a lot of the recipes and the basic stuff you need to craft at first (I never would have guessed that you're supposed to get stones with a wooden pickaxe, or build a furnace by making a circle out of stones).

If Minetest is to become significantly different from Minecraft, it needs to have a way for people who aren't already familiar with it to easily pick it up, something that seems to be lacking at the moment. It needs that regardless, actually. A built-in crafting guide, a more clear inventory screen (clearly distinguishing the crafting grid from the inventory), and most importantly, a help screen with just the basics of how to start playing (visual, with minimal text) would go a long way in this direction.

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by 4aiman » Post

onpon4 wrote:as far as I can tell, his overall impression of the game so far is positive, and I think he would play it as often as Minecraft if his friends were playing it, too.
There are a lot of that kind of people, even here many players came from MC. And I don't understand why we can't copy features from there. In Minetest almost all features are OPTIONAL presented in a form of mods. There are pretty much talks about minecraft lameness (I even was accused of hating MC O_o), but c'mon, minetest IS a clone in many ways. As a clone we CAN became more popular than minecraft. As a different game - not likely.
Why is that?
Well, amongst minecrafters (even those with positive attitude) minetest always will be only a clone. BUT! Manic digger or the likes of it are wa-ay far from both minetest AND minecraft. Minetest have so much attention amongst minecrafters because it IS similar. And all they (minecrafters) want before switching to minetest (I'm talking about adequate people who are able to see potential in minetest) or playing both of them is minecraft features they like and get used to. Lame or not - IT DOESN'T MATTER. If Minetest will take it's own path, anyone here should forget about Minecraft and it's features.
We have same craft recipes, we have redstone counterpart (overhauling one), we have farming and tries to make somee mobs but we don't wanna be minecraft clone? Ridiculous. Simple and plain. Copying AND creating new features is the way, copying AND probably changing crafts to more reasonable (for devices like those of buildcraft or IC2 (Hi there, RealBadAngel! You're doing great job!) is the way, copying AND overshadowing is the way. Not diverting.

It's pretty pointless to try to convince anyone that we should go a way of Internet Explorer. ("Wut?!!" is not an option, Mito ;)
Yes, IE. MS was copying Netscape Nevigator in every feature they could and when the time of IE 4.0 had came they (MS) were like a train ready to squash the Netscape.
IE is lame, sure. But at least 50% of users all over the world (much more, actually - lowered for those who probably would say I'm exaggerating) use IE! And IE 10 is really fast and neat (nope, I'm totally for Firefox, so that's no ads of IE or Win8).

Anyone can say that IE is a crap (and it is), but Minetest consists of mods which can be separated and installed/uninstalled independently. We (and by that I mean Minetest) need to became Firefox-like (in terms of "extensibility" ) and chase Minecraft, adding more it's features and more features that minecraft DO NOT HAVE. In fact we have plenty of what minecraft do not have, but we don't have some of it's features too. One can't just came and say that IE/Windows is crap and user should switch to another browser/OS. That's too hard for too many people.

In the end personally I see Minetest called a clone of minecraft, which have more features then latter, more fun to play and superior in everything except bugs. I didn't say "lameness", cause that's too subjective to be said. Everyone have their own thoughts about what is "lame".

All Minetest need is "configurability". Mods is the great way to do that. But we also need new callbacks for Lua, pathfinding and simple mobs AI in C++. I'm not bithcing about anything. But mobs are slow and stupid. And they will stay so, unless some basic AI would be coded in C++.

As for the renewable lava, obsidian and stuff like that... Those who want renewable lava should have an option in config. But I don't really care about it. Just remember, that first one want more lava and then he/she will ask to ban a griefer who use that easy-to-get lava. Obsidian being hard to crack is lame? Then make a substitute and call it whatever you like. Just remember, that calling it "obsidian" will be less lame then make a new ore as a substitute. In first case minecrafter will say: "Oh, MT is just a clone. Good one, possible, but a mere clone", while in the second one minecrafter will say: "OMG!!! They took our obsidian, called it a different name, drew some horrible textures, added some questionable crafts from it and spoiled in every way! Copy it PROPERLY if you do!!! God, it's like playing lame Minecraft...".
Anyone who will try to say, it's just my point of view, will be ignored, cause it's not - Minetesters want their lava back, Minecrafters want their nether and mobs and hunger-meter. Minetest is a community project atm. And community want both MC an MT features. Not all of us, not all the features, but we want.

I suggest a little experiment:
Calinou said he tried to make a game as close to MC as he can. PilzAdam have his Minitest game and there are other mods like snow etc. Also there are some unmerged minecraft-like features for the game engine.
So... Is there any who can and want to try build a geme engine + minetest_minecraft_game that will copy minecraft as much as it's possible atm? We create special topic, a youtube channel, social networks groups and see what happens and how many people will come to minetest and will help it to develop it and how many will come just to play.
Oh, if anyone want to mention blockplanet_old or other two-year-old-fork (despite blockplanet still have some features MT doesn't), then I'm talking about a fork with all minetest have atm and will have in the future.

If this will fail, then anyone who (like me) was for making MT closer to MC should shut up. I'll definitely will do that. Those who can understand no one needs smth will too (I'm pretty sure). Other non-adequate persons may treated as trolls then.
Last edited by 4aiman on Fri Mar 22, 2013 08:24, edited 1 time in total.

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Linxx
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by Linxx » Post

this is all i have to say it's ok to be original i actually encourage it but from what i have seen from the game industry both open source and non open source (don't know how to call the othe rone) both indie and mainstream there's always and i do mean always a bit of copying in the games i just want to sugest this, try to take the good ideas from MC and make them your own with some personal touches that would fit into MT and take the really bad ideas as a learnign expirience maybe you will find the solution to theyr bad idea and implement it into the game or come up with a whole new idea and ofcourse bring out your own original ideas into the melting pot too isn't that what comunity is all about making a good soup of ideas and mixing it well for a new flavor :) hope this helps a bit

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by jojoa1997 » Post

onpon4 wrote:Let me throw in my two cents:

I've never played Minecraft and never will because I refuse to use nonfree software (where "free" refers to freedom, not price). My brother has, and does, though. He first tried Minetest because he had heard from me that it is a clone of Minecraft and wanted to see how it is. Since he was downloading from Linux Mint's repos, he was playing 0.3.1, but he had a good experience; he expressed surprise that the game was actually a pretty decent clone. He introduced it to me, and we played it. We haven't played in a while, but as far as I can tell, his overall impression of the game so far is positive, and I think he would play it as often as Minecraft if his friends were playing it, too.

Point is, I really don't think Minetest needs to avoid being like Minecraft. In fact, I think being like Minecraft is an asset: it makes it easier for Minecraft players to jump right in, like my brother did. Sure, some people will complain that the game isn't "original", but people will complain either way, and of course, there's always mods.

Actually, maybe it's just me, but I think this game has an incredibly steep learning curve for someone who isn't familiar with Minecraft. I say this because, when I first saw the game, I was dumbfounded by the inventory screen; I only understood it when I played with my brother for the first time and he explained that the cube of 9 squares was used to "craft" things (from the appearance, I had assumed that it was mere inventory space), and he also helped with a lot of the recipes and the basic stuff you need to craft at first (I never would have guessed that you're supposed to get stones with a wooden pickaxe, or build a furnace by making a circle out of stones).

If Minetest is to become significantly different from Minecraft, it needs to have a way for people who aren't already familiar with it to easily pick it up, something that seems to be lacking at the moment. It needs that regardless, actually. A built-in crafting guide, a more clear inventory screen (clearly distinguishing the crafting grid from the inventory), and most importantly, a help screen with just the basics of how to start playing (visual, with minimal text) would go a long way in this direction.
i was discussing this in irc. They said no to adding a crafting guide that people could use. Why not give it on start-up. A crafting guide would get rid of the need to have a beginner level and also it would help with mods. People say use a mod(which i do) but i am asking for it to be added for the new players. Also using a book as a tool would help alot. Maybe get writing in books possible and give a begginers guide to players when they join the first time. Also it should be shutoff able with the config for experienced players.
Last edited by jojoa1997 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:06, edited 1 time in total.
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by Evergreen » Post

Chinchow wrote:Says Minetest is a Minecraft clone.
Complains that Minetest doesn't have things Minecraft has.
Intelligence.
+1
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by jordan4ibanez » Post

Minecraft clone, complains about Minecraft features.

This post:
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by mauvebic » Post

Meh, the way i see it, you got two groups of people vying for influence here: Those that have heard of and played Minecraft first, and those who heard of minetest first. Im in the latter. Being in the latter, i tend to look at features for their merits, without having any basis for comparison.

That being said, i've never been a fan of playing follow the leader, because you never get ahead that way. I'd rather we clean their chronometers and show them how it's really done, we'll know we're ahead when their players start complaining that MC is copying MT. But i know im in the minority on that :p
Last edited by mauvebic on Fri Apr 12, 2013 04:16, edited 1 time in total.

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