Linuxdirk - how about instead of having ideological discussion, how about actually developing a game instead of playing with apples and oranges.Linuxdirk wrote:We don’t even need to compare it to Forge. Just have a look on what Resource Packs are capable of doing. Or all the internal API stuff that is changable by a shit-ton of userspace commands and configuration options.Byakuren wrote:Not sure if this has been mentioned yet but we should also consider what Minetest is lacking as a modding platform compared to Minecraft Forge, since that is the main platform for Minecraft mods.
It makes me sad that a closed-source game owned by microsoft and developed in obfuscated Java code has a better modding API and options than an open-source engine intended to be a modding platform.
Some devs (unfortunately those with the most influence) are even strongly arguing against more configuration options or extending the API to allow more changes of the core features.
What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
I can understand both sides. In one side are the core devs. They have limited time and won't get payed for their work. They can't implement everything a modder or game Dev wishes.
On the other side are the game developers who can't make the game they want because of the limitations of the engine.
I really wish we had better mobs, but I think it will be impossible to do that in lua because it will always be laggy. But we don't have enough core devs to do that and I don't have the experience to make it myself
On the other side are the game developers who can't make the game they want because of the limitations of the engine.
I really wish we had better mobs, but I think it will be impossible to do that in lua because it will always be laggy. But we don't have enough core devs to do that and I don't have the experience to make it myself
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Missing engine features for MineClone 2
Because it's relevant I just dump two lists of missing Minetest features which are required for MineClone 2, a Minecraft clone:
List of missing engine features: http://repo.or.cz/MineClone/MineClone2. ... EATURES.md
List of MineClone 2 issues with the label “needs engine change”: https://github.com/Wuzzy2/MineClone2-Bu ... e%20change
The second list is updated automatically and the first list is updated whenever I feel like it.
List of missing engine features: http://repo.or.cz/MineClone/MineClone2. ... EATURES.md
List of MineClone 2 issues with the label “needs engine change”: https://github.com/Wuzzy2/MineClone2-Bu ... e%20change
The second list is updated automatically and the first list is updated whenever I feel like it.
Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
This is already possible (see replacements), but...- Require tools to be intact in crafting
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5323
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
The two games are so similar, on the visual scale (regardless of diff textures or colors) that it sets off a link in the brain.
To some brains: They look similar so, they should behave similar. (so why don't they?) 0_o
To other brains: I know they are different, but I want them to behave the same, because I don't want to or am unable to pay $26.95 for it. (or however much the price is, I forget ) :P
To a few brains: These two are vastly different and unable to behave exactly the same but, I'm not frustrated enough at work and/or other aspects in life so... I shall persevere to make them behave the same (or slightly more similar)... thus throwing myself into the abyss of nutbaggery. If I'm gonna go insane, I'd rather just go full tilt than half assed... :P
Then, there's this brain: Hey look!!!! Now I have two cool and fun games to play.... kewwwl : )
These are the 4 MT/MC related brain patterns in the human psyche.
The ONLY sane, and happy one..., is the last in the list.
:D
To some brains: They look similar so, they should behave similar. (so why don't they?) 0_o
To other brains: I know they are different, but I want them to behave the same, because I don't want to or am unable to pay $26.95 for it. (or however much the price is, I forget ) :P
To a few brains: These two are vastly different and unable to behave exactly the same but, I'm not frustrated enough at work and/or other aspects in life so... I shall persevere to make them behave the same (or slightly more similar)... thus throwing myself into the abyss of nutbaggery. If I'm gonna go insane, I'd rather just go full tilt than half assed... :P
Then, there's this brain: Hey look!!!! Now I have two cool and fun games to play.... kewwwl : )
These are the 4 MT/MC related brain patterns in the human psyche.
The ONLY sane, and happy one..., is the last in the list.
:D
A Wonderful World
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Jordach. what exactly are you trying to say?
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
I don't know if you're being serious but I don't think this is accurate.ABJ wrote:The attitude of quite a lot of Minetesters and devs is just sad. "Minetest is not Minecraft. STFU and GTFO. Period. We don't give a damn what you 12-year-old creeperheads want."
Every time a mod API is left undocumented, a koala dies.
Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
No !
MT is not MC because have not shadows )
MT is not MC because have not shadows )
I am a noob. still yet. Not so noob ) [vml] WIP and a little proof for fun PlantedTorch )))
MT Strike 78a36b468554d101e0be3b0d1f587a555f396452 Great! Somebody have found it )
"My english isn't well" I know. I'm sorry )
MT Strike 78a36b468554d101e0be3b0d1f587a555f396452 Great! Somebody have found it )
"My english isn't well" I know. I'm sorry )
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Byakuren, that's what I've seen.
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Not exactly like that, but I've seen something like "we can't do/name/have something like this-or-that because Minecraft has that".Byakuren wrote:I don't know if you're being serious but I don't think this is accurate.ABJ wrote:The attitude of quite a lot of Minetesters and devs is just sad. "Minetest is not Minecraft. STFU and GTFO. Period. We don't give a damn what you 12-year-old creeperheads want."
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Minecraft is nothing but shit. At least, that's what I've heard.
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Financial backing from MS?? :P
Financial backing from MS?? :P
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Microsoft has killed Minecraft. What financing do you talk about? I can't even start the Minecraft BOTH on Linux and Windows - it crashes. And I don't even bother to write a bugreport to them because my previous bugreport is still open and it's like 5 years old already.TumeniNodes wrote:What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Financial backing from MS?? :P
So, what's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
1. Huge maps over 2kk blocks wide.
2. Multiple maps for the same world. (even more important than #1 because you could've simulated #1 using #2)
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Um, you mean 2k?drkwv wrote:1. Huge maps over 2kk blocks wide.
Minetest maps are 62k^3 blocks.
Copying world seeds can generate the same world. Or just copy/paste a world folder and name it something else.2. Multiple maps for the same world. (even more important than #1 because you could've simulated #1 using #2)
Unless what you mean is realms, in which case you are correct, are not supported (yet).
Last edited by GreenXenith on Tue Apr 25, 2017 14:48, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
I mean 2 million.GreenDimond wrote:Um, you mean 2k?
Maybe realms. They're also called dimensions/subworlds. Completely different worlds inside one world, like in Minecraft's Mystcraft mod. Although "minecraft realms" is a sort of web hosting and that's not what I'm talking about. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00_8_4tDBtwGreenDimond wrote:Unless what you mean is realms, in which case you are correct, are not supported (yet).
Last edited by drkwv on Tue Apr 25, 2017 07:17, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Uhm ...GreenDimond wrote:Minetest maps are 32k^3 blocks (even though the Minetest website says 62000^3).
http://wiki.minetest.net/FAQ#How_big_is_the_map.3F[...] As of 0.4.10, the map is a cube with a side length of 61840 node lengths. The map has thus a volume equal to the volume of 61840^3 nodes = 236,487,637,504,000 nodes. The coordinates range from −30912 to 30927 in all dimensions.
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
GreenDimond, you appear to ignore the minus coordinates. Also, thanks, Linuxdirk.
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Ah, yes I forgot the - coords. But that is not the point.Linuxdirk wrote:Uhm ...GreenDimond wrote:Minetest maps are 32k^3 blocks (even though the Minetest website says 62000^3).http://wiki.minetest.net/FAQ#How_big_is_the_map.3F[...] As of 0.4.10, the map is a cube with a side length of 61840 node lengths. The map has thus a volume equal to the volume of 61840^3 nodes = 236,487,637,504,000 nodes. The coordinates range from −30912 to 30927 in all dimensions.
I don't need it told twice, thankyou.ABJ wrote:GreenDimond, you appear to ignore the minus coordinates. Also, thanks, Linuxdirk.
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Wait what? I play the same pack on Linux and Windows. :Ddrkwv wrote:I can't even start the Minecraft BOTH on Linux and Windows - it crashes.
Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
I am very happy for you. You do not have to believe me if you do not want to.DcNdrew wrote:Wait what? I play the same pack on Linux and Windows. :D
Also, here is the bug I was talking about: https://bugs.mojang.com/browse/MC-23320
Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
I believe you.drkwv wrote:I am very happy for you. You do not have to believe me if you do not want to.DcNdrew wrote:Wait what? I play the same pack on Linux and Windows. :D
Also, here is the bug I was talking about: https://bugs.mojang.com/browse/MC-23320
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Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
Such bitterness! Why?
Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
I was talking with my brother about this very thing and this is my diagnosis; Minetest is missing SOMETHING TO DO! Now I'll be honest; I really only play the LOTT server (and even then, not very often, I am taking a break from Minetest), and that game is wonderful. However, this was literally my first experience on my first Minetest "survival" world:
DAY ONE: I hurry and get some apples, cut down a tree, build myself a pickaxe and I spot a sheer cliff. Cool! No zombies (or other mobs) will be able to get me! I dig into the sheer cliff, cut out a 4x6 space for myself, put up a door and hunker down for the night.
DAY TWO: I go out, explore a little, find some ore, go back to my house and hunker down again. However, with my torch I realize that there are NO ZOMBIES! In fact, there are no mobs at all! Even worse, there's no hunger, so the only way I can die is by jumping off the sheer cliff. I promptly do so.
What Minetest is missing is incentive for you to do something. If I can do nothing but stand on the ground and not die or lose, the game (as packaged) is pretty worthless. Name any other popular game, they all require involvement.
And it's not like there aren't any quality Minetest games out there! Like I said, I most play LOTT (Lord of the Test). I'm not an LOTR fan, but I play LOTT because at least LOTT gives me something to do. (Plus, our mountain is surrounded by a dragon, and I am curious as to how I should slay it.)
Maybe the Minetest leaders should incorporate a game that has the right balance of excitement and vanilla-ness.
DAY ONE: I hurry and get some apples, cut down a tree, build myself a pickaxe and I spot a sheer cliff. Cool! No zombies (or other mobs) will be able to get me! I dig into the sheer cliff, cut out a 4x6 space for myself, put up a door and hunker down for the night.
DAY TWO: I go out, explore a little, find some ore, go back to my house and hunker down again. However, with my torch I realize that there are NO ZOMBIES! In fact, there are no mobs at all! Even worse, there's no hunger, so the only way I can die is by jumping off the sheer cliff. I promptly do so.
What Minetest is missing is incentive for you to do something. If I can do nothing but stand on the ground and not die or lose, the game (as packaged) is pretty worthless. Name any other popular game, they all require involvement.
And it's not like there aren't any quality Minetest games out there! Like I said, I most play LOTT (Lord of the Test). I'm not an LOTR fan, but I play LOTT because at least LOTT gives me something to do. (Plus, our mountain is surrounded by a dragon, and I am curious as to how I should slay it.)
Maybe the Minetest leaders should incorporate a game that has the right balance of excitement and vanilla-ness.
I test mines.
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Drop Minetest Game as default
Note that Minetest does not equal Minetest Game.
Almost all problems with Minetest Game will be instantly solved it is just ditched it as the default subgame and replaced with something more complete. Pixture looks promising (even if it is very simplistic), but it needs bugfixes. I'm inclined to suggest to rename Minetest Game to Paramat's Game because paramat seems to be the only major force behind this right now. ;-D
Joke aside, paramat once said that Minetest Game is not even really intended as a complete and exciting subgame. Which really begs the question of why the hell should we be shipping a subgame which is incomplete by design as a default. I'm not saying Minetest Game development should stop as it can still be useful as a “modding base”. But this is clearly something for developers, not players (especially new players!) and therefore is a poor default selection.
Either that, or we should plaster a big fat red warning everywhere that Minetest Game is not really playable at the moment, that you are expected to install mods and/or that the real games/subgames can be downloaded at <insert URL here>. Minetest Game is alpha-stage software at best.
Or we just drop the idea of a default subgame altogether and ship nothing by default and advertise every subgame at a reasonable level of quality and completion more or less equally. Hint: Minetest Game does not have “a reasonable level of quality and completion”, as of version 0.4.16. Unless you take mods into account, but then we need that big fat red warning again. :D
Almost all problems with Minetest Game will be instantly solved it is just ditched it as the default subgame and replaced with something more complete. Pixture looks promising (even if it is very simplistic), but it needs bugfixes. I'm inclined to suggest to rename Minetest Game to Paramat's Game because paramat seems to be the only major force behind this right now. ;-D
Joke aside, paramat once said that Minetest Game is not even really intended as a complete and exciting subgame. Which really begs the question of why the hell should we be shipping a subgame which is incomplete by design as a default. I'm not saying Minetest Game development should stop as it can still be useful as a “modding base”. But this is clearly something for developers, not players (especially new players!) and therefore is a poor default selection.
Either that, or we should plaster a big fat red warning everywhere that Minetest Game is not really playable at the moment, that you are expected to install mods and/or that the real games/subgames can be downloaded at <insert URL here>. Minetest Game is alpha-stage software at best.
Or we just drop the idea of a default subgame altogether and ship nothing by default and advertise every subgame at a reasonable level of quality and completion more or less equally. Hint: Minetest Game does not have “a reasonable level of quality and completion”, as of version 0.4.16. Unless you take mods into account, but then we need that big fat red warning again. :D
Re: What's Minetest still missing over Minecraft?
I'm for the big fat red warning everywhere!
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