Super Duper Graphics Pack

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Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Neuromancer » Sat Jun 17, 2017 11:52

Wow, Minecraft's "Super Duper Graphics Pack" looks intense https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1WHYJH-JGk How can Minetest compete with this?
 

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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by burli » Sat Jun 17, 2017 12:06

Neuromancer wrote:How can Minetest compete with this?

It can't
 

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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Nyarg » Sat Jun 17, 2017 13:04

Mrrrf, .... shadows ...

And why don't try use something like ENB ?
http://enbdev.com
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Calinou » Sat Jun 17, 2017 13:16

Nyarg wrote:And why don't try use something like ENB ?
http://enbdev.com


Not only it is not open source, it looks like it targets Direct3D-based games, which is a no-go for us. We can also do better than injection, since Minetest's full source code is available.
 

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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Jordach » Sat Jun 17, 2017 16:02

Perhaps the core devs should've took their OpenGL support for these even further instead of COMPLAINING about anything that touches Irrlicht.

tl;dr Open Source software never competes against ANY professional paid for product.

Moral high ground means nothing to a business who can get support instead of "fucking google the wiki".
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by TumeniNodes » Sat Jun 17, 2017 17:26

Does it come with super duper fps?
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Jordach » Sat Jun 17, 2017 17:36

TumeniNodes wrote:Does it come with super duper fps?

Windows 10 Edition / XBOX / Switch / PE all run on C++ as a base.

Go figure it'll run damn well.
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by TumeniNodes » Sat Jun 17, 2017 17:42

Well..., poop
Like I say, "To all the A$$#oles with all the $$$ go the spoils."

But here is the point...
"How" can MT compete with that? IDK, I did not realize we were "competing"?

And to compare an open source, volunteer software to another which sold out for big $$$$ and is now backed by an unlimited source of it... doesn't make any sense.
With all the money and employees and private contractors behind MC, it had better look this good. Especially since they like to charge people on a per singular, license basis.
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by TumeniNodes » Sat Jun 17, 2017 18:10

Oh and btw..., (sorry for dbl post)

put an MT organization together, (non-profit)
join the Summer of Code project,
actively look at various means of bringing in donations,
actively seek to recruit talent, in areas of need,
talk to other organizations in the FOSS community to get ideas on these things...

No need to keep comparing MT to MC these are two totally different animals.
Makes more sense to focus on MT than worry about what MC is doing, or what it has... I see far too much of this here.
Every time you turn around you see, "MC this, or MC that".... what has any of it to do with MT?

And for all this money etc MC has behind it... "THE SUPERDY DUPER GRAPHICS PACK"...
a f@#&ing Barney commercial??!!!! That's the best name they could come up with???

And true..., quite a few lower end free games have reflective water, etc.... so? Try to get in touch with the devs for that game, ask them for some advice, tips, or maybe if they could take a few moments to see how MT could benefit... with shadows... etc....
Troll some opengl/glsl forums...
Reach Out!!!

A project I was with long ago had split, and when an effort was made to build something new from it began, suddenly there were contributors from places in the community some would never have even expected...
But this was because individuals were reaching out, contacting skilled people and asking questions, for advice, raising curiosity... for every 3 people who are curious..., 1 will be interested.

Put out ads...:
MT is seeking skilled developers in (enter fields here)
Benefits & Perks = sleepless nights, thankless applaud and complaints about what you didn't do, online harassment, and four hours of vacation following release points. :D

Lure them with truth, disguised as humor
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by toby109tt » Sat Jun 17, 2017 21:20

Tomenynodes those are some wise words very professional but no one will probably do anything with this

Also the direction minetest is headed in is very problematic it turns people off
Also also are you trying to advertise minetest?
Bdw before you ask yes I do try to advertise minetest if possible :)
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by TumeniNodes » Sun Jun 18, 2017 03:37

I have contacted a couple of skilled individuals I have known over the years, to see if they were interested in contributing. They are very busy with RL situations and numerous projects atm.
I have sent emails to a couple of other individuals I only know through acquaintances, same goes for them aside from 2 I have not heard back from (I believe the contact info for one is long outdated)

So, yes..., I do..., in a way.
There are still numerous individuals I have not contacted but, I am aware they too are heavily involved with other projects in the opensource community.
And some have simply withdrawn their involvement with such projects.

Finding serious, skilled, contributors for an opensource project is most often, fairly difficult.
The most important factor, is normally that it requires peaking their interest. (usually a subject they are passionate about) games don't normally fulfill this requirement for most, unfortunately.

The gaming industry, mostly attracts contributors in the area of "gain", whether it be financial, or recognition (fame).
There are not many who want to put in hours and hours of work..., with no profit at the end. This takes individuals who are really passionate about it, and/or the particular game software they are working on. (which says a lot about MT devs)
For all the little digs I see thrown their way here and there, they still remain. Because they have to? No, because they want to.

I wish that I were able to offer "serious" contribution, but I am unable to... The most I am able to offer is ideas (which are like a$$holes... everyone's got one.) And basic mods, and texture packs / graphics related contributions.

This SUPER DUPER thingy... is all about shaders, and the $$$$ to hire the skilled individuals out there to do the work.
I can promise one thing..., this "super pack" has quite a bill behind it.

Nothing about it impresses me..., simply for the fact it is an MS product..., which is simply created to obtain even more $$$$... (I have no problem with capitalism... I do have a problem with the morals of some capitalists) and MS has always been on a very low end scale of morals.

I don't like MS for many reasons..., literally nothing they have ever done, was for good intentions, or for the betterment of anyone else, aside from themselves and their shareholders, and other interested parties.
And I loathe their licensing practices...

Imagine the day when you can walk into a store and purchase a cd.... but, you can only play it on one particular brand of cd player..., and even if you have two or more of that particular brand..., you would be required to purchase a single user license of the cd, to play on each individual cd player... : /
Even better, if you don't ever get to purchace an actual "physical" "cd"..., but a ghost copy of it. Now you are getting even less of an actual product... for more $$$, and at the end of the day, the contents of that cd are actually nothing more than bunch of wasteful, over rated, bloated, and extremely bland..., crap.
And everytime you try to play the contents, it has a new problem, and downloads things you don't even want, while also making you open to viruses... but fear not citizen!!!! Now you can also purchase a copy of this anti-virus software (which we have shareholders/interests in ; ) ) which is also a single user license fee!!!! Weeeeeeeee!
That is "MS" in a nutshell.

When MC sold out to MS..., it was already on it's way down the $#itter.
This little boost of this super duper thingy, should have come quite a while ago... and will most likely be the last "big deal" in quite some time.
It's just being used to lure the suckers back in, because popularity is fading. Give the suckers (I mean consumers) "just enough" to bait them back in, nail em when they bite..., then let the excitement wear down again before releasing the next new "super duper" thing (which is probably already, ready to go)

Companies like MS are masters at stringing consumers along. They are also the masters of crap, and MS is one of very few corporations which have been allowed to get away with numerous monopolies, infringements, cornering and blocking markets, numerous unethical business practices, etc., etc., etc... because.... "money" (and LOTS n LOTS of it)

I wonder how many here, have ever dug around much into various "interests" related to MS or which they are involved in (including subdivisions / child companies/entities) some of it is in the political scene, as well as areas of laws and regulations.... it's quite interesting.
MS is, and has been for a while..., quite well connected... and can basically do and get away with what ever the hell they like.
Kinda like those MC's which are involved in legal and illegal businesses... but do a charity bike run once in a while to keep their political friends happy and cover everyone involved, a$$es covered.

For every one good or nice thing MS does..., it has been involved in 5 more not so nice things.
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by toby109tt » Sun Jun 18, 2017 14:13

We need to advertise minetest to some other Community's like the Minecraft and terraria Community That will bring in some more poeple

And more people means more contribution!
We can beat minecraft but we need to work for it

You and me TumeniNodes let's do this let's advertise minetest!
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Byakuren » Sun Jun 18, 2017 22:42

Competing isn't a choice. Technically all games are competing with each other for play time, but Minetest and Minecraft particularly fill the same niche (voxel sandbox game). MT also competes with other sandbox games.

It doesn't matter whether Minetest developers are "trying" to compete with Minecraft because the fact is that the games are similar visually and on a basic gameplay level. Players who are choosing between Minetest and Minecraft will want to see what distinguishes MT from MC, and what makes it better than MC in the things they have in common. I won't mention any specifics since people have already discussed it extensively.
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by azekill_DIABLO » Fri Jun 23, 2017 14:36

burli wrote:
Neuromancer wrote:How can Minetest compete with this?

It can't

oooiiiinnnn
 

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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by azekill_DIABLO » Sat Jun 24, 2017 14:26

toby109tt wrote:We need to advertise minetest to some other Community's like the Minecraft and terraria Community That will bring in some more poeple


yes but they all think minetest is a minecraft rip-off and cheaty (or even pirated). Because it's called minetest.
 

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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by MineYoshi » Sat Jun 24, 2017 16:02

azekill_DIABLO wrote:
toby109tt wrote:We need to advertise minetest to some other Community's like the Minecraft and terraria Community That will bring in some more poeple


yes but they all think minetest is a minecraft rip-off and cheaty (or even pirated). Because it's called minetest.

It's how you'd actually present it, based upon that people will have an opinion about the game.
 

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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by azekill_DIABLO » Sat Jun 24, 2017 16:31

i tell something simple: an opensource (free) game developped by community that you can fully extand, change or improve.
 

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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by SAMIAMNOT » Wed Aug 23, 2017 16:15

A couple people have shaders (viewtopic.php?f=3&t=156&p=210741&hilit=shader#p210741) (viewtopic.php?f=3&t=156&p=285254&hilit=shader#p285254) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajv7l2V ... e=youtu.be) Looks like better shaders will be added in the future. Not Super Duper, but better.
Image (I still wanna know how this was done.)


Image
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by voxelproof » Wed Aug 23, 2017 17:13

I've seen it a couple of days ago and I do understand some angry comments about "killing the true Minecraft" by MS.

The issue here is that sandbox games like MC gained its popularity not because of the polished, shiny high-resolution visuals characteristic of the AAA titles. It won the hearts of the players due to some quite opposite merits: simplicity, low-res graphics resembling drawings from child's books and overall fairy-tale ambient. With the announced "Super-Duper" release it is apparently being trasformed into yet another product of the corporate industry and the voxel space of its words in my opinion don't match well with its overdriven use of high-end hardware. It will appear a cul de sac and the beginning of the end for MC I'm afraid (because I like it a little bit, though not that much as Minetest I must admit).

And, the most important thing is that imo MT can achieve similar effect with working out better textures (which can mimic some 3d patterns of the surfaces and even make water look more realistically, Summerfields is a good hint of possible improvements in this subject) and better atmospheric scattering (or occlusion, I don't know the proper english term for the phenomenon of changing colour of the distant objects due to the optical properties of the air). Since I am experimenting with my own textures I watched this video with personal interest so I can say that, really, if you want to achieve visual ecstasy you don't have to buy the newest Xbox :))

MC with its super-duper pack is proving that it is becoming more and more the game for the rich (owners), and MT with each and every next mod or good texture pack is proving that it is the game for the intelligent (users and contributors). What is especially important to me is the feeling of the possibility of gaining the total control over the source of the admired worlds and it really causes great excitation. This prompts both imagination and creation towards the most wonderful exploration of the MT universe - that of unveiling its yet hidden potential.
Last edited by voxelproof on Fri Sep 01, 2017 15:37, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Byakuren » Thu Aug 24, 2017 15:31

It's nothing new that Minecraft has unexpectedly high system requirements, especially with lots of mods loaded. Also people have been using computationally expensive shader mods for a long time already in MC. I don't think every fancy effect can be adequately faked with good textures, but unfortunately Minecraft has the upper hand in textures as well, because they hire professional artists, as well as a more active community for producing texture packs.

MC with its super-duper pack is proving that it is becoming more and more the game for the rich (owners), and MT with each and every next mod or good texture pack is proving that it is the game for the intelligent (users and contributors).

This sounds like a non-sequitur to me. Minecraft gets quality mods and texture packs at a higher rate than Minetest does, so why doesn't it also show that its users are intelligent (Maybe in addition to being rich)? Some kinds of mods that exist in Minecraft (I am thinking of some magic / magitech mods with interesting systems) don't even have anything similar in Minetest. Also, does this mean you oppose rendering improvements in Minetest because they might increase system requirements when you enable shaders? I would love for Minetest to succeed over Minecraft, but could we use real arguments?

I think the "killing Minecraft" is more about Microsoft putting the Java, portable version into maintenance mode in favor of its Microsoft platform version, and also about how Minecraft has been getting dumb filler like colored beds and parrots instead of real new features.

Currently I think Minetest's main advantages over Minecraft are the low system requirements, an official modding API and one that doesn't get broken every release, and not being proprietary. Gameplay-wise I also like that Minetest has a much deeper (as in physically) world than Minecraft.
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by voxelproof » Thu Aug 24, 2017 17:59

Byakuren wrote: I don't think every fancy effect can be adequately faked with good textures,


Maybe not every one, but my point of view is the one of an excellent artistic paintings admirer. You won't find any other shaders or ray-tracing effects in Rembrandt's Night Watch or Soleil Levant by Monet than those put down by the brush-hand-made oil-paint textures.

but unfortunately Minecraft has the upper hand in textures as well, because they hire professional artists, as well as a more active community for producing texture packs.


Well, unfortunately I find some of the textures in Super Duper to be rip-offs from Terasology (maybe it's just only my mistaken impression, I'm not sure)...

This sounds like a non-sequitur to me. Minecraft gets quality mods and texture packs at a higher rate than Minetest does, so why doesn't it also show that its users are intelligent (Maybe in addition to being rich)?


I don't say Minecraft users are not intelligent! But it's more and more obvious that the smell of the big money and commerce is present in its development. It is no longer an indie game, it is set up to become more and more enclosed by the hardware and release policy with a prospect (this is my impression after watching this announcement) of swallowing all MC modding and disabling non-controllable modding activity. This is a standard corpo policy - taking advantage of some spontaneous creativity induced by a product and then turning it into one itself.

What was born out of a true passion of Notch as a true gaming art is turning into plastic toys factory. It's not about fun any more when you can feel that strenuous pursuit of $ ;)

Also, does this mean you oppose rendering improvements in Minetest because they might increase system requirements when you enable shaders?


Until it's not an option only - no. But if I would have to buy better hardware or graphics to be able to run Minetest at all I would say farewell to it.

I would love for Minetest to succeed over Minecraft, but could we use real arguments?


What is a measure of success in that regard? Quantity (of users)? I prefer quality.

It's because I prefer Gigoia Studios' "Impressionista: Water Lilies" over all the Minecraft mods. Well, it is my artistic bias, I know (though I have some ideas about gaming in voxel sandboxes).

Currently I think Minetest's main advantages over Minecraft are the low system requirements, an official modding API and one that doesn't get broken every release, and not being proprietary. Gameplay-wise I also like that Minetest has a much deeper (as in physically) world than Minecraft.



100% agree.
Last edited by voxelproof on Fri Aug 25, 2017 12:02, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Nyarg » Fri Aug 25, 2017 04:42

Byakuren wrote:Currently I think Minetest's main advantages over Minecraft are the low system requirements


But what is about
nrz wrote:Another important point, Master branch now uses C++11 standard. Direct consequence: Windows XP is not supported anymore, and old distros like Debian 7 or RHEL/Centos 6.


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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Byakuren » Fri Aug 25, 2017 14:17

Nyarg wrote:
Byakuren wrote:Currently I think Minetest's main advantages over Minecraft are the low system requirements


But what is about
nrz wrote:Another important point, Master branch now uses C++11 standard. Direct consequence: Windows XP is not supported anymore, and old distros like Debian 7 or RHEL/Centos 6.


What is next ?
DotNet, java, cloudDB's (

Low system requirements isn't the same thing as supporting old operating systems.
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Nyarg » Fri Aug 25, 2017 22:32

Byakuren wrote:
Nyarg wrote:
Byakuren wrote:Currently I think Minetest's main advantages over Minecraft are the low system requirements


But what is about
nrz wrote:Another important point, Master branch now uses C++11 standard. Direct consequence: Windows XP is not supported anymore, and old distros like Debian 7 or RHEL/Centos 6.


What is next ?
DotNet, java, cloudDB's (

Low system requirements isn't the same thing as supporting old operating systems.

LOL ))) because new operating systems isn't Low system requirement.

A = B , B = C so A = C
BUT
A = B , B <> C
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Re: Super Duper Graphics Pack

by Byakuren » Sat Aug 26, 2017 03:01

Nyarg wrote:LOL ))) because new operating systems isn't Low system requirement.

A = B , B = C so A = C
BUT
A = B , B <> C

If you are talking about Windows or OS X then sure, but I run Debian testing with i3 and it's very lightweight. It's not my fault you are fixated on Windows.
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