[Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

Dorje
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dorje » Tue Oct 06, 2015 08:45

Is it playable but not finished? Or just unplayable?
Give me some EXTREME HARDCORE xD

i have to say this sad thing viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13458&p=195719#p195719
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Ferk » Tue Oct 06, 2015 10:03

Actually it's playable, but probably very unbalanced. It's perhaps interesting to explore the dungeon, but it won't keep you entertained for hours or anything like that, since there's not much content yet. There are very few interesting rooms and some rooms are basically placeholders.

Maybe someone else can give some opinion on the current status since like I said I didn't playtest it much. And since I'm the one developing I'd probably not be able to tell properly.

Maybe I'll work next on the probabilistic nodes. I'm thinking about adding a tool for DungeonMakers so they can mark nodes to have a chance of not getting placed.

I've also in my list to check Wuzzy's Treasurer mod. Right now the content of the chests is probably quite boring since same rooms have same content.
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by celeron55 » Tue Oct 06, 2015 11:06

I like this!

I mean, it's not without its problems -- You're equally fighting the slimes as you are fighting the laggy engine when it decides to generate new areas in the worst possible situations... but the good parts are worth it.

Just add a lot more room variety and a goal and it already is a game. It might need some form of permadeath to allow it to overally make sense, but it's your call. Then all it needs is boatloads more of polish, on the engine side also. Not visual polish, but all kinds of practical things.

I like the challenge rooms where you can't progress without having a few spare nodes or suitable spells with you. That right there is some true dungeon stuff.
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Ferk » Tue Oct 06, 2015 15:03

celeron55, I'm honored to receive you feedback :P ..that's an injection of motivation right there.

Just add a lot more room variety and a goal and it already is a game

Originally, I intended to make the dungeon finite, with a bottom level and some sort of "Amulet of Yendor" type of object. But ever since I decided to make it infinite I'm not sure what kind of goal to add just yet. I mean.. should there actually be a last level? Anyone has ideas?

Maybe a portal room of sorts that only spawns at certain dungeon depth and teleports to a boss area? Then people can decide whether they are ready to enter the portal or continue further down the dungeon to get more and better loot.

It might need some form of permadeath to allow it to overally make sense, but it's your call

Yes, I'm still thinking what exactly to do on death. The first thing I should do is remove the checkpoint altar that currently is in every ladder room. Perhaps losing the inventory in the depths of the dungeon is already good enough punishment on death. But if not I could also make the player bones come to life when you find them so you'd have to fight back against your past ghosts for some extra punishment (I think it would be interesting to see how this plays in multiplayer, since you'd be able to fight the ghosts of other players).

But this would be something to think about only after I'm done with the level design.

Then all it needs is boatloads more of polish, on the engine side also. Not visual polish, but all kinds of practical things.

Agreed. I'm open to ideas. Perhaps some rooms might be ugly right now, but that can be fixed later, I'm more worried about the gameplay at the moment.

The game is designed so that it should be easy to register new altars, new spells, new chest traps, etc.

I like the challenge rooms where you can't progress without having a few spare nodes or suitable spells with you. That right there is some true dungeon stuff.


Glad that someone noticed! I'm considering if I should actually try to implement keys and locked doors/checks or not. After all it would be more interesting to block the path with some obstacle that only certain spell can break.

It would be really cool if I could add some sort of "trigger" nodes that activate some behavior when stepped on. But I'm not sure if there's some efficient way to do this. I don't want to include something like Mesecons that'd probably be too much and the rooms are not big enough for complex mese circuits anyway, but something simpler for simpler stuff (locking/unlocking the exits?) would be cool.
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dartmouth » Tue Oct 06, 2015 15:13

Ferk wrote:Maybe a portal room of sorts that only spawns at certain dungeon depth and teleports to a boss area? Then people can decide whether they are ready to enter the portal or continue further down the dungeon to get more and better loot.

I like that idea a lot, sounds great.

Ferk wrote:But if not I could also make the player bones come to life when you find them so you'd have to fight back against your past ghosts for some extra punishment (I think it would be interesting to see how this plays in multiplayer, since you'd be able to fight the ghosts of other players).

DC:SS does this, sometimes you find your ghost in the area where you died.

Ferk wrote:Glad that someone noticed! I'm considering if I should actually try to implement keys and locked doors/checks or not. After all it would be more interesting to block the path with some obstacle that only certain spell can break.

I would prefer having spells instead of also having to find keys.

Ferk wrote:It would be really cool if I could add some sort of "trigger" nodes that activate some behavior when stepped on. But I'm not sure if there's some efficient way to do this. I don't want to include something like Mesecons that'd probably be too much and the rooms are not big enough for complex mese circuits anyway, but something simpler for simpler stuff (locking/unlocking the exits?) would be cool.

Yes, that would be really cool. Maybe borrow some code from the mesecons pressure plate or player detector and combine it with code from digilines or pipeworks' teleporting tubes to transmit a signal without circuits.
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by kaadmy » Tue Oct 06, 2015 16:30

celeron55 wrote:I like this!

I mean, it's not without its problems -- You're equally fighting the slimes as you are fighting the laggy engine when it decides to generate new areas in the worst possible situations... but the good parts are worth it.

Just add a lot more room variety and a goal and it already is a game. It might need some form of permadeath to allow it to overally make sense, but it's your call. Then all it needs is boatloads more of polish, on the engine side also. Not visual polish, but all kinds of practical things.

I like the challenge rooms where you can't progress without having a few spare nodes or suitable spells with you. That right there is some true dungeon stuff.

Haven't seen you on the forums for a long time :)
If i'm correct, last time you posted was on VoXus several months ago.
Never paint white stripes on roads near Zebra crossings.

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by celeron55 » Tue Oct 06, 2015 22:40

kaadmy wrote:Haven't seen you on the forums for a long time :)
If i'm correct, last time you posted was on VoXus several months ago.


You can see all of my posts here: search.php?author_id=2&sr=posts
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by kaadmy » Tue Oct 06, 2015 23:22

celeron55 wrote:
kaadmy wrote:Haven't seen you on the forums for a long time :)
If i'm correct, last time you posted was on VoXus several months ago.


You can see all of my posts here: search.php?author_id=2&sr=posts

So I was wrong :)
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Ferk » Wed Oct 07, 2015 08:44

Last night I added the treasurer mod from Wuzzy and two new chest types to the dungeon: "Common Treasure" and "Rare Treasure".

These act as "treasure spawners" for the Treasurer mod from Wuzzy and will offer any loot that is registered in treasurer. The preciousness of the loot inside gets higher the deeper the Dungeon level and it's higher for the Rare Treasure.

However, the amount / rarity / preciousness of the items is probably unbalanced at the moment. It's a bit hard to find some loot to add in this game that could be common and less valuable and at the same time not outright useless or game-breaking (I can't add any place-able blocks like cobblestone because it would break some challenges, neither makes sense to add crafting ingredients that require a 3x3 grid).

I'm thinking adding some sort of currency, gold coins or so that they could be found in small amounts and that I might use for shops later on.

Any other ideas of common and less valuable stuff? Maybe I could add some rotten food or some items that have some drawback. Perhaps very worn out weapons / armor with low durability, and/or low quality.

Maybe I could make up some crafting recipes suitable for the basic 2x2 craft grid. This way if players get a certain amount of apparently useless items they could turn into something actually useful, otherwise it would be just junk.

I guess I would have to have a look at how I want the equipment system to be. Should I add weapons with special metadata for them to have random levels of quality?

If I can make itemstacks that can't be split, I could use the amount of items in the stack as a number to represent the "level" of the weapon. That would be nice. I think I've seen mods use this for their tools to have different effects, so I guess it should be possible.
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dorje » Wed Oct 07, 2015 11:34

You doing well so far :)
Btw r u gonna make tools only possible to get from chests because u said u r making a 2x2 craft grid?
Give me some EXTREME HARDCORE xD

i have to say this sad thing viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13458&p=195719#p195719
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Ferk » Wed Oct 07, 2015 14:31

Thanks, Dorje.
Yes, tools are already in the pool of possible treasures for the chests.
But this is not your traditional minetest game. Most of the time having tools wouldn't be very useful, because either the nodes will be undiggable or they won't drop anything when digged (you'll just destroy it without getting anything back).

Or at least that's the plan.. probably there are things that could still be exploited at the moment.
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dorje » Thu Oct 08, 2015 14:14

Then swords will only be gettable from chests? swords r useful :)
At 1 point i was thinking of making a mod like this but your mod is fantastic :)
Give me some EXTREME HARDCORE xD

i have to say this sad thing viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13458&p=195719#p195719
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dartmouth » Thu Oct 08, 2015 15:15

I like this a lot. Somehow the spawners don't really seem to work, I've only met the lava mobs (which have really nice models and animations!) and chest mimics so far. I like the dungeons though, they look nice. Might get around to creating some rooms of my own, right now it does get a bit repetitive after a while ;)
BTW, I haven't looked at the code yet, but is it possible to make certain rooms spawn at lower levels than others? I.e. rooms with different levels of difficulty that would spawn further down?
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Evergreen » Thu Oct 08, 2015 19:28

This looks great! It reminds me of a game that celeron55 made for minetest a while back called Dungeon. It is nice to see someone making some good content for minetest.
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Ferk » Thu Oct 08, 2015 22:00

Ferk wrote:I didn't add an in-game way to edit these settings yet.. but it's planned.

Done!
I'd like to introduce you the legendary Tome of DungeonMaking:
+ Spoiler

It will be given automatically to the player when he joins in creative mode, if it didn't have one already, along with some text making him know that in creative mode things like treasures and spawners won't work the same way. So that nobody else makes the same mistake.

I think with this making dungeon rooms should be fairly simple.

Maybe I'll try next to give some more love to the mob spawners.
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Ferk » Sat Oct 10, 2015 18:07

Ouch!! ...... instead of pressing "quote" on my own comment I pressed "edit" and removed the whole thing when replying to myself -_-
I guess there's no way now to recover my post.

Oh well... I have no time now to reproduce what I said before (and it was quite a long one) but I hope the images for the Tome of Dungeonmaking are explanatory enough. I'll have to update the documentation in git later anyway..

I'm sorry, I probably should go have a nap.
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dorje » Tue Oct 13, 2015 16:34

How's The game going?
Right now its looking awsome! :-)
Give me some EXTREME HARDCORE xD

i have to say this sad thing viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13458&p=195719#p195719
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Ferk » Tue Oct 13, 2015 17:31

Thanks Dorje!

After finishing the tome of Dungeonmaking I worked a bit in the spawners (now they use proper timers, so the mobs will also respawn when the player is away as well) I'm not sure if the timer maybe is too fast by default (4 minutes), what do you think would be a good interval for the mobs to respawn?

I was also thinking on adding some button that would "toggle" some nodes out of existence and back. I have some ideas for rooms , traps and puzzles that could be created using something like this. But I'm not sure if I'll be able to get to do it until the weekend.

Oh! and I forgot to mention that I added some new scroll spells: teleportation and invisibility (though this last one is mostly an experiment)

I also realized that I'm probably doing it wrong by using "right click" for the scrolls to be applied to oneself, since this is done in the "on_place" callback which only works when you are actually pointing to something you can place the scroll at. I should probably switch the controls and use right-click for casting the spell to the pointed thing and left click for casting to yourself.
However, I find this makes it very inconvenient and inconsistent, since normally you always use left click to hit things in the environment.

Imho, mientest needs a "on_secundary_use" callback (or maybe replace the left click action with an "on_punch_with" instead of triggering "on_use"). This is also the case for food and books and so. Left click, imho, should only be used for hitting things or using objects that have some impact on the pointed thing.
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dorje » Tue Oct 13, 2015 18:10

maybe faster!
As u can see on my sig i love hardcore style things like UHC on MC xD U dont need to make it hardcore if u dont want to because i could edit it for myself :)
Give me some EXTREME HARDCORE xD

i have to say this sad thing viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13458&p=195719#p195719
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dorje » Tue Oct 13, 2015 18:11

Hardcore and building r my favorite things on MT/MC

So the harder the better :D

I want a world or server where i use no privs and play hardcore xD
Give me some EXTREME HARDCORE xD

i have to say this sad thing viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13458&p=195719#p195719
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by kaadmy » Tue Oct 13, 2015 19:23

Dorje wrote:[...]
So the harder the better :D

I want a world or server where i use no privs and play hardcore xD

If you'd like, I know a private server running Pixture, it's designed for survival, PM me if you want to play there :)
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dorje » Wed Oct 14, 2015 09:21

kaadmy wrote:
Dorje wrote:[...]
So the harder the better :D

I want a world or server where i use no privs and play hardcore xD

If you'd like, I know a private server running Pixture, it's designed for survival, PM me if you want to play there :)

unfortunately im making things like extremely hardcore stuff so i cant play servers right now but i will try it out and pm u when :-)
Give me some EXTREME HARDCORE xD

i have to say this sad thing viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13458&p=195719#p195719
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Ferk » Wed Oct 14, 2015 12:12

Dorje wrote:U dont need to make it hardcore if u dont want to because i could edit it for myself :)


I'm not sure if it's worth it to add a setting for changing a default value, nor am I sure whether it makes sense to add a difficulty option, since I might have then to rate every room with a difficulty value which might be troublesome to manage and subjective to rate.

But the game should get harder and harder the deeper you go so I guess there should be a sweet spot for everyone, the dungeon is big enough.

Also, since this is inspired by roguelikes, beating the game should be something quite hard, but hopefully rewarding. It's just that there isn't much content yet, so there's not too much of a progression at the moment (neither there's a goal to begin with..).
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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Dorje » Thu Oct 15, 2015 06:39

Ferk wrote:
Dorje wrote:U dont need to make it hardcore if u dont want to because i could edit it for myself :)


I'm not sure if it's worth it to add a setting for changing a default value, nor am I sure whether it makes sense to add a difficulty option, since I might have then to rate every room with a difficulty value which might be troublesome to manage and subjective to rate.

But the game should get harder and harder the deeper you go so I guess there should be a sweet spot for everyone, the dungeon is big enough.

Also, since this is inspired by roguelikes, beating the game should be something quite hard, but hopefully rewarding. It's just that there isn't much content yet, so there's not too much of a progression at the moment (neither there's a goal to begin with..).



I am saying i know a bit of lua and will copy the modpack to myself in harder versions (i wont post anything).
I dont mind waiting for a while because this really looks interesting.
Give me some EXTREME HARDCORE xD

i have to say this sad thing viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13458&p=195719#p195719
 

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Re: [Game] Dungeontest (very WIP)

by Ferk » Sat Oct 17, 2015 20:58

I added yesterday the aforementioned "toggler" buttons and a new room to showcase them under the name "Lava Wall".

These buttons can "toggle" nodes on and off (exchanging them with air), they can be assigned to any number of nodes. To edit which nodes are toggled when creating a room in creative right clicking a button toggler while holding a tome of dungeonmaking, this will turn the "edit mode" for that button, which basically allows you to punch the nodes that you want to assign to the toggler. Then right click again the button with the tome to save the selection. Then next time the button is activated the nodes you selected will toggle.

I think these buttons could be used in a lot of ways. Puzzles, traps etc. A button can toggle another button (or even toggle itself!), so a chain of buttons could be created to enforce a particular order to, for example, open an exit. They can also show/hide things like chests, the content and metadata should be preserved. They can be used to open the floor below, make a monster spawner appear, block all the doors in the room... all without needing mesecons.

The only problem at the moment is that if a node is saved as toggled ("air") in the schematic it won't preserve the param2 value when loaded, so the rotation might be messed up (and this actually affects toggling buttons because they depend on the orientation). But I think I can fix that. I have some other room prepared but I won't add it to the pool until this is fixed.

I was also tweaking a bit the fire mod. Fire should now burn flammable blocks faster than before. The flames took always too long to do anything before.

Also.. things from the top of my head that are done (I talked about it before but it got deleted): there should be no more problems with the entrances, also the missing chest metadata that Wuzzy reported was actually a problem with rotation that got fixed as well, and there are 2 new scrolls: teleportation and invisibility (though the last one is just an experiment since it's not very useful)
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