Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

Apo
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Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

Hi everyone,

a month ago I created this public PvE server as part of my project http://linuxiuvat.de with whom I aim to promote free software games and Debian GNU/Linux. I'm a member of the Debian Games Team and I have recently made a contribution to Debian's minetest package by adding support for systemd and sysV-init scripts. You can now quite easily set up and maintain new minetest servers, almost everything is automated now. I'd like to add this information to the Wiki but I can't create a new account. Any idea how I can get past the confirmation step? I don't see the cat image...really

Yggdrasil

I tend to use names from Norse mythology for some of my servers and Yggdrasil, the world tree, seemed quite fitting for a Minetest server. I always wanted to create a PvE server with a focus on shaping the world and with a lingering sense of danger. I am using the official Debian package with the goal to create a stable and reliable server, close to the default minetest_game and only with a few extra mods installed. I hope I can find the right balance between features and performance.

Mods
So far for the currently installed mods. The list is not necessarily complete and I will probably test and add some other mods in the future too.

I had to remove the tnt mod because it causes more harm than fun in the wrong hands. The rest is pretty standard and I am still tweaking the server configuration. Regular server reboot and backup is at 06:45 UTC. Everything else is most likely an update or a crash due to a current bug in 3d_armor. Perhaps this can be resolved by installing the inventory_plus mod. Not tested yet.

Standard privs are: shout, interact, home

You can contact me via PM or by using the information at http://linuxiuvat.de/contact.htm

Enjoy the game!

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ExeterDad
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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by ExeterDad » Post

I'd like to be the first to welcome you. And very interested in those Debian scripts :)

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

Hi ExeterDad, thanks for the warm welcome!

I guess I can share the info about the new minetest-server features here too.

The new package is available in Debian Sid: minetest-server
It should be no problem to install this one on Jessie too, a backport wouldn't be necessary. Here is the snippet that I wanted to add to the Wiki.

== Running the minetest server as a systemd service or sysV-init daemon ==

Since version 0.4.10+repack-3 the Debian minetest-server package automatically creates a system-wide, unprivileged user called '''Debian-minetest'''. The home directory of this user is ''/var/games/minetest-server''. You can do all the configuration in ''/etc/minetest/minetest.conf''. All log files are written to ''/var/log/minetest''.

=== systemd ===

Start the server with

<pre>systemctl start minetest-server</pre>

Stop the server with

<pre>systemctl stop minetest-server</pre>

You can disable the server on boot with

<pre>systemctl disable minetest-server</pre>

You can start multiple servers with different configurations by using systemd's template unit feature.

<pre>systemctl start minetest-server@pvp.service</pre>

Provided that you also saved the configuration file for this server in ''/etc/minetest/pvp.conf'', the server will now use this second configuration and log everything to /var/log/minetest/pvp.log.
Simply replace '''pvp''' after @ with your desired name.

=== sysV-init ===

If systemd is not your default init system and you still prefer to use the old sysV-init style configuration, you can use the service command to start or stop your server.

<pre>service minetest-server start</pre>
or
<pre>service minetest-server stop</pre>

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Hybrid Dog
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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

You could add pioneer (http://pioneerspacesim.net) to http://linuxiuvat.de/

Edit: please add rare but well made mods to your server

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Apo
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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

Hybrid Dog wrote:You could add pioneer (http://pioneerspacesim.net) to http://linuxiuvat.de/
Thanks for the suggestion. It looks promising. However nobody has created a Debian package for it yet and that's a precondition for including it on linuxiuvat.de.
Hybrid Dog wrote:Edit: please add rare but well made mods to your server
Someone needs to tell me more about "rare" mods and their stability because I'm quite new to Minetest and don't know every mod yet. At the moment I am looking for a server mod that makes it possible to remotely control the server via console commands or at least something that lists all players on the server and allows the admin to perform certain commands on them like /grant, /give etc. with a nice UI.

Is there already a mod that announces custom messages to all players such as "The server is going down for maintenance in 5 minutes"?

What well made mods do you suggest for the server? Of course they should be appropriate for a survival/PvE server.

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

Apo wrote:
Hybrid Dog wrote:Edit: please add rare but well made mods to your server
Someone needs to tell me more about "rare" mods and their stability because I'm quite new to Minetest and don't know every mod yet. At the moment I am looking for a server mod that makes it possible to remotely control the server via console commands or at least something that lists all players on the server and allows the admin to perform certain commands on them like /grant, /give etc. with a nice UI.

Is there already a mod that announces custom messages to all players such as "The server is going down for maintenance in 5 minutes"?

What well made mods do you suggest for the server? Of course they should be appropriate for a survival/PvE server.
some of them are mine, tell me if you need more
viewtopic.php?id=628
viewtopic.php?id=3616
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10265
viewtopic.php?id=4772
viewtopic.php?id=2538
viewtopic.php?id=5159
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=7146
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10319
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10318
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10271
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10268
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=8917#p142632
viewtopic.php?id=3631
viewtopic.php?id=3933
viewtopic.php?id=8095
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10264
https://github.com/Megaf/more_chests
viewtopic.php?id=4676
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=10789
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=9574
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4339
viewtopic.php?id=5721
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10263
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10275
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=5987
viewtopic.php?id=3806
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10262
viewtopic.php?id=7147
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=7689
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10272
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10270
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10267

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Apo
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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

Thanks for your list. It contains some mods like grass, moss, special_pick and trashcan that are certainly a nice addition to the default game. I will consider them. Do you know of any good admin/server mods for controlling the server? The rulesacc mod was interesting. I guess I could use that as a start for server messages.

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

Apo wrote:Thanks for your list. It contains some mods like grass, moss, special_pick and trashcan that are certainly a nice addition to the default game. I will consider them. Do you know of any good admin/server mods for controlling the server? The rulesacc mod was interesting. I guess I could use that as a start for server messages.
l just made a mod for controlling the server without joining it.
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10809

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Apo
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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

Hybrid Dog wrote:l just made a mod for controlling the server without joining it.
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=10809
That's an interesting mod. Thanks! I will have a look at all those server methods and give it a try myself. I'm mostly interested in:
  • granting players certain privileges while not being online
  • a simple message visible to all players, executed at a fixed time and then (optional) repeated in an interval for x minutes
Happy Christmas holidays

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

Your moss and grass mod are now running on the server. I would suggest that you change the print line in init.lua and use minetest.log instead. This way it would be possible to reduce the verbosity of logging messages when the log level is changed to ERROR or even to none.

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

Apo wrote:Your moss and grass mod are now running on the server. I would suggest that you change the print line in init.lua and use minetest.log instead. This way it would be possible to reduce the verbosity of logging messages when the log level is changed to ERROR or even to none.
ok, thanks

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Sokomine
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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Sokomine » Post

Apo wrote: a month ago I created this public PvE server as part of my project http://linuxiuvat.de with whom I aim to promote free software games and Debian GNU/Linux. I'm a member of the Debian Games Team and I have recently made a contribution to Debian's minetest package by adding support for systemd and sysV-init scripts. You can now quite easily set up and maintain new minetest servers, almost everything is automated now. I'd like to add this information to the Wiki but I can't create a new account. Any idea how I can get past the confirmation step? I don't see the cat image...really
That's good! But what's mainly needed is the game as such. Singleplayer is fine, but not everyone needs to run a server :-)
The cat image might be broken. Best ask on IRC about it.
Apo wrote: Someone needs to tell me more about "rare" mods and their stability because I'm quite new to Minetest and don't know every mod yet. At the moment I am looking for a server mod that makes it possible to remotely control the server via console commands or at least something that lists all players on the
server and allows the admin to perform certain commands on them like /grant, /give etc. with a nice UI.
Who needs an UI for that? :-) There's an irc mod out there that adds a bot connected to your server to an irc channel. You can give the server commands over that. To learn more about it, best join irc and i.e. talk to VanessaE. She runs several servers.
Apo wrote: Is there already a mod that announces custom messages to all players such as "The server is going down for maintenance in 5 minutes"?
Krock did a mod for that specific message on his server. Works very well.
Apo wrote: What well made mods do you suggest for the server? Of course they should be appropriate for a survival/PvE server.
That depends a lot. Sadly, my first impression of your server was bad: It looks like one of these unmaintained, griefed servers, where one turns away fast and doesn't start building because there's no point. Griefed buildings, 1x1 pillars, chaos.

Please install a /spawn command and add a spawn building. It may be as simple as a plaza with a wall where the rules are listed and the server is introduced. There ought to be a craft guide hanging there as well so that players can find out how they can create new blocks. A sign explaining how to craft the craft guide itshelf and how to protect land might also be a very good idea. You also ought to explain /home and /sethome.

Eventually, start anew with a new map. The current one doesn't seem to contain anything worth keeping. In general, servers ought to keep their map forever and only move the spawn point elsewhere if it gets too crowded, but in this case a plain new map will be a lot nicer. There's also the option to choose another mapgen with diffrent biomes. I'd love to see a server with the forrest mapgen.

Players tend to like shop systems for trading. There are several mods available for that.

Survival/PvE is a bit more difficult. Hunger and a wider variety of food comes to mind first. The specialities mod might also be of intrest, although that may not be maintained and will require adjustments. Achievements might be a good idea as well. Wasteland, AdventureTest and to a degree RealTest add more to the game in the direction of survival challence/progress beeing more difficult.

It's probably best if you try out a few mods in singleplayer and visit a couple of servers in order to get an idea what works and what doesn't. Players also tend to require a lot of attention; there'll be all these tablet users, and most of them will be small children. Expect to hear "I'm bored" with an implicit "do your duty and entertain me now!" quite frequently :-/ A noguest/no bad usernames mod is also extremly helpful. It keeps those players away that can't be bothered to think of a name for themshelves.

Unlike Minecraft servers, Minetest servers usually do not compete against each other, and server owners and moderators will be more than willing to help new collegues get their server running well.
A list of my mods can be found here.

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

Hi,

first of all many thanks for your extensive reply.
That's good! But what's mainly needed is the game as such. Singleplayer is fine, but not everyone needs to run a server :-)
The cat image might be broken. Best ask on IRC about it.
I just saw a thread about the broken wiki registration. I will ask for an account there.
Who needs an UI for that? :-) There's an irc mod out there that adds a bot connected to your server to an irc channel. You can give the server commands over that. To learn more about it, best join irc and i.e. talk to VanessaE. She runs several servers.
I guess you were talking about https://github.com/kaeza/minetest-irc ? That looks interesting indeed. Thanks. I think an administrative UI for server commands is still something that is badly needed for Minetest. Imagine all the non-techie folks out there, that just want to give players some items. I find it quite counter-intuitive to assign certain items to players. e.g sometimes I have to type /give player default:diamond and sometimes I can omit default? Why? What is the name/item string of this item...*looks in wiki.minetest.net*. I mean I would expect tab-completion at least. :-)
Minetest is currently in a state where early MMO's were at the beginning of the last decade. They all had a powerful command-line but when I first played World of Warcraft and saw this excellent and user-friendly user interface, after ten minutes I knew that this game would become the reference for all further MMOs. So in regard to Minetest I would wish that there was a simple GUI to select players and perform commands and actions on them. This might not only be useful for the server admin but for other players too, who have been granted only a subset of the server's privileges.
Apo wrote:Is there already a mod that announces custom messages to all players such as "The server is going down for maintenance in 5 minutes"?


Krock did a mod for that specific message on his server. Works very well.
Thanks. Will do a search for his mod.
That depends a lot. Sadly, my first impression of your server was bad: It looks like one of these unmaintained, griefed servers, where one turns away fast and doesn't start building because there's no point. Griefed buildings, 1x1 pillars, chaos.

Please install a /spawn command and add a spawn building. It may be as simple as a plaza with a wall where the rules are listed and the server is introduced. There ought to be a craft guide hanging there as well so that players can find out how they can create new blocks. A sign explaining how to craft the craft guide itshelf and how to protect land might also be a very good idea. You also ought to explain /home and /sethome.
I think I should better explain my intentions for this server. First of all it is not manageable for me to supervise the server all the time. Only a group of players (guild, clan) are able to fulfill this task efficiently. I have done this a lot in the past but for this project with 13 different games already, I have other plans. The servers should usually run open for the public and should require as little interaction as possible. Usually the games support features like /vote or /setmaster, so players are able to choose their prefered style of gaming. I currently listen a lot to players to find out what they want and I then install the required mods for that purpose, if they are stable and efficient enough. I also grant privs like /give or /kick to regular players, so that they can protect their buildings and they can also use the protector mod to prevent other players from destroying their buildings.

Your idea with a customized spawn is great and some of the players already started to work on that and I tried it too. The problem is that this requires additional mods whereby I feel that the game would benefit from implementing an indistructible spawn by default. It simply shouldn't be possible to modify the area around the spawn point and to trap other players. The crafting guide is invaluable and should also be part of the default game. In general all those points you mentioned apply to all game servers, so naturally it makes sense to fix this issue on "the game level" itself. It shouldn't be part of the server administrator's job to explain the game to the players. A good game should always be self-explaining or in case of MMOs be explained by the players to other players.
Eventually, start anew with a new map. The current one doesn't seem to contain anything worth keeping. In general, servers ought to keep their map forever and only move the spawn point elsewhere if it gets too crowded, but in this case a plain new map will be a lot nicer. There's also the option to choose another mapgen with diffrent biomes. I'd love to see a server with the forrest mapgen.
At the moment I intend to stick to the map because there are players who built "a fortress" or some other objects and my general impression is that they enjoy the game and I don't want to start anew just because some other parts of the map are less maintained at the moment. However I think you are right that I should better explain how they can protect their buildings but as I wrote above this should not require the server admin's intervention.
It's probably best if you try out a few mods in singleplayer and visit a couple of servers in order to get an idea what works and what doesn't. Players also tend to require a lot of attention; there'll be all these tablet users, and most of them will be small children. Expect to hear "I'm bored" with an implicit "do your duty and entertain me now!" quite frequently :-/ A noguest/no bad usernames mod is also extremly helpful. It keeps those players away that can't be bothered to think of a name for themshelves.
The noguest mod is a good idea. I will install that. I know that there are lot of young players on the server and that's fine. They have to figure out themselves how they would like to play the game. I see myself merely as the administrator who makes sure that the server runs stable and installs the necessary mods to enjoy the game.
Unlike Minecraft servers, Minetest servers usually do not compete against each other, and server owners and moderators will be more than willing to help new collegues get their server running well.
That's great and I appreciate any help or suggestions for this server. Linuxiuvat is about promoting free software games and I just want to show that there are a lot of good free multiplayer games. Of course this project does not compete with anybody. It's just about having fun. Cheers.

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Aijo » Post

Just gave the server a try, and a quick suggestion would be a spawn point and teleport priv to players, in case they get lost.

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

Aijo wrote:Just gave the server a try, and a quick suggestion would be a spawn point and teleport priv to players, in case they get lost.
Thanks for the feedback. I have now enabled a new /spawn command which will bring every player back to the spawn point. In addition all players have the /home and /sethome privilege. I hope that helps.

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

Apo wrote:At the moment I intend to stick to the map because there are players who built "a fortress" or some other objects and my general impression is that they enjoy the game and I don't want to start anew just because some other parts of the map are less maintained at the moment. However I think you are right that I should better explain how they can protect their buildings but as I wrote above this should not require the server admin's intervention.
thanks

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

Attachments
minetestmapper map (newer)
minetestmapper map (newer)
lala.png (662.43 KiB) Viewed 1001 times
The PilzAdam map mod map
The PilzAdam map mod map
map.png (484.93 KiB) Viewed 1001 times

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

Thanks for the maps! I will upload your lava_cooling mod today. Let's see if it works :)

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

Apo wrote:Thanks for the maps!
np, they could be fairly outdated at some places

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by mystik » Post

HybridDog: How did you generate that isomorphic map @ github?

Also, I'm operating a server based on Debian Jessie, with systemd. I've added the following directives to the unit file to help lock down the minetest server: ($USER should be replaced accordingly)

Code: Select all

User=$USER
WorkingDirectory=/home/$USER

# MT Has a signal handler for SIGINT
KillSignal=SIGINT

# Lock down the process, hard.
ProtectSystem=full
PrivateDevices=true
NoNewPrivileges=true
ReadOnlyDirectories=/
ReadWriteDirectories=/home/$USER/.minetest
PrivateTmp=true
I don't know if the Debian package can provide similar protections by default, or if folks want to add these. This works because the mods I have enabled *only* touch files in the .minetest directory.

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

mystik wrote:HybridDog: How did you generate that isomorphic map @ github?
l used https://github.com/Zeg9/onomatopoeia.
Generating it took a long time and l had to find out myself that l needed to put the map.sqlite into the folder.
mystik wrote:Also, I'm operating a server based on Debian Jessie, with systemd. I've added the following directives to the unit file to help lock down the minetest server: ($USER should be replaced accordingly)

Code: Select all

User=$USER
WorkingDirectory=/home/$USER

# MT Has a signal handler for SIGINT
KillSignal=SIGINT

# Lock down the process, hard.
ProtectSystem=full
PrivateDevices=true
NoNewPrivileges=true
ReadOnlyDirectories=/
ReadWriteDirectories=/home/$USER/.minetest
PrivateTmp=true
I don't know if the Debian package can provide similar protections by default, or if folks want to add these. This works because the mods I have enabled *only* touch files in the .minetest directory.
idk, there's a pull request for mod security https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1606

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Apo
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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Apo » Post

mystik wrote: Also, I'm operating a server based on Debian Jessie, with systemd. I've added the following directives to the unit file to help lock down the minetest server: ($USER should be replaced accordingly)

Code: Select all

User=$USER
WorkingDirectory=/home/$USER

# MT Has a signal handler for SIGINT
KillSignal=SIGINT

# Lock down the process, hard.
ProtectSystem=full
PrivateDevices=true
NoNewPrivileges=true
ReadOnlyDirectories=/
ReadWriteDirectories=/home/$USER/.minetest
PrivateTmp=true
I don't know if the Debian package can provide similar protections by default, or if folks want to add these. This works because the mods I have enabled *only* touch files in the .minetest directory.
I'm using a backport of the Debian "experimental" package of Minetest, 0.4.11+repack-1. The default Debian package creates a non-privileged user called "Debian-minetest". The home directory is in /var/games/minetest-server and my mods are stored in the "worldmods" directory. In my opinion that should suffice.

I have changed only one value of the systemd service file.

Code: Select all

[Unit]
Description=Minetest multiplayer server minetest.conf server config
Documentation=man:minetestserver(6)
After=network.target

[Service]
Restart=always
User=Debian-minetest
Group=games
ExecStart=/usr/lib/minetest/minetestserver --config /etc/minetest/minetest.conf --logfile /var/log/minetest/minetest.log

[Install]
WantedBy=multi-user.target
I have replaced Restart=on-failure with Restart=always because some mods crashed the server but didn't trigger the restart mechanism. You can place custom service files in /etc/systemd/system.

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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Aijo » Post

What method of land claiming have you implemented? I've seen other players have claimed land, but can't seem to find the block/command that grants them that land. Are you using the mesecons or another block?

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Hybrid Dog
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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

Aijo wrote:What method of land claiming have you implemented? I've seen other players have claimed land, but can't seem to find the block/command that grants them that land. Are you using the mesecons or another block?
these chatcommands could work:
/area_pos1
/area_pos2
/protect myhouse

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Hybrid Dog
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Re: Yggdrasil [linuxiuvat.de]

by Hybrid Dog » Post

about every 6 seconds l get a stutter, which is visible as peak in the drawtime loop
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