[Game] A Tome With Trials [WIP]

[MineYoshi]

A lot of things can be done with `minetest.override_item` and even crafting recipes can be removed, but I'm left to wonder if that's really wanted and makes things more flexible to begin with.

For my part, I'm against overriding. It may create confusion, and some mods might do something with the item def before it is redefined. I think it's cleaner to directly modify the code as long as we have the files history with the git repo (so no need to keep the original files unchanged).

+1

+100

[Gael de Sailly]

I think we should nearly begin from scratch (only copy the most basic features from MT game) and define each block, and not hesitate to diverge from MT_game. Too many subgames are only a partial rewrite of MT_Game with some mods added with very few modifications, so the whole is not coherent (Examples of lack of coherence: 2 different crafts with the same recipe because added by mods which where not made to work together, mobs that don't appear on such biome because the surface node didn't exist when the mod was written… or even about texture styles…).
By rewriting all, we'll be sure to have a natively stable and coherent subgame.

Some things I propose:
Ores:

• Inequal distribution of ores. Some ores should be completely absent at some places and common at other places, so the player will have to mine very far to find all. Possible with noise params.
• What I propose:
  • Coal
  • Copper
  • Iron
  • Tin
  • Zinc
  • Gold, rare
  • Topaz (mese) as sofar said
  • Diamond: EXTREMELY rare. You should mine deep and at the good place. Diamond is way too common in MTG.
  • Several stone types: granite, basalt, marble, limestone… These stones may also contain ores.
• Alloys: more various than in MTG. Steel is not plain iron, it needs carbon. Bronze = copper + tin (not iron). Brass = copper + zinc. In order to mix metals, you'll need to melt it in a special furnace.

Trees:

• I've chosen 9 trees:
  • Oak
  • Beech
  • Birch
  • Pine (like Pinus Pinea, in hot and dry places, contrary to MTgame's pines which are firs !)
  • Fir
  • Jungle trees
  • Mahogany
  • Palm tree
  • Apple tree
• Of course, they shouldn't be copied from any existing mod.
• Size of trees: bigger than in MTG, smaller than in Moretrees. Ideally 12-15 nodes for a beech or oak, less for apple, palm and birch, and more for fir and jungletree. Should vary a lot within the same species.
• Every tree should have its own wood with a slightly different color.

Plants:

• Some rare plants with very specific biomes, needed for particular crafts
• Much more intermediate plants, shrubs than in default game. Some forests with dense undergrowth will be difficultly penetrable, which will be fun. Ideas: brambles, ivy, ferns…

Weather:

• Every parameter defined by:
  • A 3d noise giving the average value
  • Another 3d noise used in a somewhat unusual way: 2 dimensions for x and z coords, and the other for time, so it would be in a way, a variable 2d noise. Adding this to the average will give the instant value.
• Temperature should be decreased by elevation

Mapgen:

• Big mountains (300 nodes high?), big oceans, floating islands
• At some places, terrain would be very chaotic, especially on mountainous places. These big mountains wouldn't be large smooth domes but irregular peaks with rocks everywhere.

Armor and damage:

• Damage shouldn't be decreased linearly by armor. I don't know whether it's possible or not, but I would like adding an important random factor to the damage.
• Also, the different pieces of the armor shouldn't receive the same wear (I know it's not possible to know on which part of the body a monster has punched, but for example if the monster is higher than the player, the helmet will be more used than the rest)

Skins:

• Human skins, which textures follow the game's style.
• Several male and female skins.
• No weird skins. This is not a fancy-dressed ball.
• Improvement of player mesh, and animations. The mesh should allow to place a hat or a long hair.

Textures:

• Avoid bright colors. Do not hesitate to make textures with very low saturation: I've noticed that a texture always looks brighter in-game.

Mobs:

• As you said, sofar, mobs animations should be redone, and textures too.
• A pixel on the animal should have roughly the same size than a pixel on the ground.
• More "intelligent" animals. Yes I know that hens have not re-invented the wheel, but they shouldn't deliberately fall of a cliff. Mobs shouldn't do moves that they can't do in the other direction, and shouldn't go somewhere they're in danger (example: a monster that can't swim shouldn't follow you in a lake).
• Interactions between mobs and player, and between mobs, should be more complex, not limited to hostile/passive mobs. Example of what I mean: Sand monsters attack players and passive mobs like chicken (that should try to run away), but fear dogs.
• Some passive mobs can become aggressive if disturbed.

Nether/Overworld:

• Do not use the classic obsidian portal to teleport in the nether. It should be really expensive, not only 14 obsidian nodes.
• The nether should be made of several successive floors, separated by 100 or 200 nodes. Every "floor" has its features. Some are reachable by teleportation, some other not so you'll have to dig down to finally end on the ceil!).

So here is my point of view on some things. I don't claim to become the leader of the project, I only want to make things move. So feel free to react if you disagree :)

[sofar]

Very good stuff, I'm on board with almost all of these points (we can discuss little details later).

I've been thinking hard about a name... "Trial of ..." something. I don't want something too weird, should be a recognizable word, not a weird name. If only I could come up with something that fits and appeals to me...! It's really the one thing I need to get started.

[pithy]

I have been playing with the idea of making a subgame to, but it has gone nowhere.
I do have a name and an icon though. Maybe my idea could merge with yours and you could call it Middle Test.

[sofar]

I have been playing with the idea of making a subgame to, but it has gone nowhere.
I do have a name and an icon though. Maybe my idea could merge with yours and you could call it Middle Test.

Honestly, the last word I'd use in a name is `test`. Also `middle` sounds way too lotr-y for my taste.

[necron099]

sofar,

As for the name why don't you see how the words 'mine', 'game', 'test' are pronounced in foreign languages, and play off of that?....just a random thought of mine. :) I think the word game sounds like ditch in Russian. (but I'm not 100% sure on that)

[twoelk]

uhm - I had some fun, enjoy

• A voxelated quest
• A chestfull of Trials and Errands
• A dark shadow on the Horizon
• A dark shadow hidden
• Do not stir the deep Shadows
• A trail of troubles
• A trial in Voxels
• Ludum Quadratum/Voxelata
• Trials in Ludology ‎
• A trail to devastation
• Unleash the trail of trials
• Stay still or Save the World
• A Trail So Far
• Unleash the menace if you dare
• Books of trials
• A trail of books
• The darkness underneath
• Pandora's Pithos in Voxels
• SoFar SoGood
• Voxelating the Circle
• A Quest of hidden Books
• Necromonicon Voxelata
• "A Story of how the Hero summoned the Threat to End All and of his trials to rid the voxely lands of what he unleashed or The quest for what lies behind the garden's fence."
• Land of Secretive Books
• A Trial in Reading
• Of Swords and Hoes
• VeniViciVoxelati
• From gardening to saving the World
• Of Gardens and Monsters

[sofar]

There's some good ones in there!

[Gael de Sailly]

Trail of Books ? I think that's the best in twoelk's list.

[sofar]

Come to think of it, some of the book names are excellent.

"The book of trials"
"A book of trials"
"The book with the trials"
"Trials in a book"

these all work really well in my mind...

[pithy]

How about "Trial of patience for sofar to name it" or "SoFar no name".

[firefox]

"SoFar no name"

+1 =(^.^)=

[sofar]

I'm currently thinking:

"A Tome With Trials"

[MineYoshi]

I'm currently thinking:

"A Tome With Trials"

Good name

+1

[pithy]

What do you think about having two armor groups, staby and smashy?

[sofar]

What do you think about having two armor groups, staby and smashy?

Completely random detailed suggestions at this stage are not very useful. If this really matters on a larger scale, please elaborate.

Remember, nothing exists in code just yet. So for ideas to be valuable, they have to have some significant part in the story and atmosphere that we're trying to convey.

The detail work comes at a later stage.

[pithy]

Completely random suggestions are not very useful.

Ok i'll stop.

[sofar]

It is named. It is in github. It can begin!

https://github.com/sofar/atwt/

[sofar]

I intend to track design in the form of github issues. This way the discussion can be tracked and we can have some sort of suggestion box per topic, which will help to keep discussions on topic.

Each subtopic will be it's own issue. The master one is kept so we can track completion towards our v1 goal.

https://github.com/sofar/atwt/issues/1

[TheReaperKing]

I know you already are pretty happy with your name but what about "The Tome". Makes me interested in what the tome is all about.

[sofar]

This is a working title. I'm not set on a final name, but I really needed a name to get something started (github repo, and something that's just recognizable by people). We can choose to change it any time.

[cd2]

I intend to track design in the form of github issues. This way the discussion can be tracked and we can have some sort of suggestion box per topic, which will help to keep discussions on topic.

Each subtopic will be it's own issue. The master one is kept so we can track completion towards our v1 goal.

https://github.com/sofar/atwt/issues/1

I think we should use this to manage tasks.

[sofar]

I think we should use this to manage tasks.

No.

We need some form of tracking but a milestone with features is more than enough. We don't need to make cutesy project manager views.

It's about code and artwork :)

The master issue and sub issues I've filed should cover what we need. Now they need detail.

And lots of code :)

[twoelk]

I just read through the issues and I just might get hooked :-D
I have experimented with changing the crafting system somewhat but keeping it balanced is not that easy. You always need a way to get started again if you are stranded with nothing and it shouldn't need hours to just get the basics done but still things shouldn't be too easy and even if you are well established some things should still be a challenge.
Endless numbers of game designers have searched for this holy grail of gaming and their remains are scattered over many "biomes"

[Tyveras]

Hi,
I'm a 3D animator and I'd like to offer my services in the creation of 'A Tome With Trials'. I've been playing Minetest on and off for a few years and I've been lurking in the forums to see what mods people come up with.

I know that the 3D style for Minetest is voxel art, and usually pretty simple; but, I'd like to help so the developers can focus on creating amazing features for this subgame, and not be burdened with the need to create the 3D assets for say, mobs, items, etc.